Dirac Live on Ultra and Pro +

[DG77]

I noticed that BluSound Node132 (2024 model) is getting Dirac as a feature, since it shares the hardware (same cpu quad core arm a53 and same sabre ess dac) Wiim should be capable of the same feat.

That would indeed sway potential buyers\upgraders to stay with the Wiim brand, myself included as I own the Wiim Pro but want more EQ control.

The price increase would mainly be for the license which is optional on BluNode and could follow the same model on Wiim.

And yes I know it has been asked for previously, but nothing ever happens unless more people show interest by posting requests.

 

[Smartplug]

I noticed that BluSound Node132 (2024 model) is getting Dirac as a feature, since it shares the hardware (same cpu quad core arm a53 and same sabre ess dac) it should be capable of the same feat.

That would indeed sway potential buyers\upgraders to stay with the Wiim brand, myself included as I own the Wiim Pro but want more EQ control.

The price increase would mainly be for the license which is optional on BluNode and could follow the same model on Wiim.

And yes I know it has been asked for previously, but nothing ever happens unless more people show interest by posting requests.

That may sounds good but we’re the type of people who like free updates and not paying license fee. All these businesses in streaming they only provide bug fix which won’t resonate on us wiim users. We’ve been getting both additional features and bug fix at no additional cost.

 

[badunn]

I’ve achieved a significantly better sound using the Wiim RC on my Arcam SR250 than using the onboard version, and so much more flexible / adjustable so doesn’t get my vote unfortunately.

 

[merifon]

I’ve achieved a significantly better sound using the Wiim RC on my Arcam SR250 than using the onboard version, and so much more flexible / adjustable so doesn’t get my vote unfortunately.

It's definitely matter of personal tastes and it's possible that not everyone prefers the most linear and correct result , regardless what it's be.
As far it concern my setup (Nad C3050LE), using Dirac made subwoofer alignment perfect and indispensable. I remember some doubt at first but they came from getting used to an incorrect situation and a non-optimal target curve (there are several more physiologically correct ones to download than the standard Dirac default). With the simple use of the PEQ, I didn't get anything remotely comparable.
Insertion of an optional Dirac like system or a more sophisticated RC, it would be a very importan plus.

 

[DG77]

That may sounds good but we’re the type of people who like free updates and not paying license fee. All these businesses in streaming they only provide bug fix which won’t resonate on us wiim users. We’ve been getting both additional features and bug fix at no additional cost.

It would not take away existing functionality (room eq etc) and the license is optional, so it would be win win or no loss for “your type of people” and a pure win/addition for those still deciding on their purchase/upgrade.

Written with kind intentions and no disrespect

 

[badunn]

It's definitely matter of personal tastes and it's possible that not everyone prefers the most linear and correct result , regardless what it's be.
As far it concern my setup (Nad C3050LE), using Dirac made subwoofer alignment perfect and indispensable. I remember some doubt at first but they came from getting used to an incorrect situation and a non-optimal target curve (there are several more physiologically correct ones to download than the standard Dirac default). With the simple use of the PEQ, I didn't get anything remotely comparable.
Insertion of an optional Dirac like system or a more sophisticated RC, it would be a very importan plus.

Don’t get me wrong… Dirac has served me well and has demonstrated how unforgiving listening spaces have been for me. But if Wiim continue to develop its RC (which it appears to be) it will be a viable alternative to Dirac and other RCs. And they’ll be doing it at the fraction of the cost. And if I were Dirac I’d be looking very carefully at what Wiim have achieved.

Despite having 2 BK 12” subs I couldn’t get a descent kick drum with Dirac; I did with Wiim RC and PEQ tweaking… but yes as you say other’s mileage may and will vary.

 

[Smartplug]

Don’t get me wrong… Dirac has served me well and has demonstrated how unforgiving listening spaces have been for me. But if Wiim continue to develop its RC (which it appears to be) it will be a viable alternative to Dirac and other RCs. And they’ll be doing it at the fraction of the cost. And if I were Dirac I’d be looking very carefully at what Wiim have achieved.

Despite having 2 BK 12” subs I couldn’t get a descent kick drum with Dirac; I did with Wiim RC and PEQ tweaking… but yes as you say other’s mileage may and will vary.

I don’t have experience on Dirac and wondering how much better their room correction.

 

[badunn]

I don’t have experience on Dirac and wondering how much better their room correction.

I wanted to try Wiim RC over Dirac as I wasn’t able to run my Arcam SR250 in direct mode using Dirac - Dirac used processing that reduced the amps SINAD (yes I’m a ASR convert). I could have purchased Dirac for my PC but glad I purchased the Wiim pro; I genuinely believe that with the Wiim’s ability to tweak the RC outcome using PEQ plus wringing the best SINAD out of my amp using direct mode has given me the best sound I’ve ever had. And given Wiim clearly have a plan to further develop / enhance its RC - Dirac, with its cost premium, now needs to catch up. I only use Dirac with my Arcam AVR390 for surround duties (where I think a lower SINAD is less noticeable).

 

[laxcoach47]

While WiiM rc is an improvement it is not the same level of improvement as Dirac. An optional Dirac license would be a nice option. It would provide an improvement now that WiiM could/would eventually offer.

 

[DG77]

I wanted to try Wiim RC over Dirac as I wasn’t able to run my Arcam SR250 in direct mode using Dirac - Dirac used processing that reduced the amps SINAD (yes I’m a ASR convert). I could have purchased Dirac for my PC but glad I purchased the Wiim pro; I genuinely believe that with the Wiim’s ability to tweak the RC outcome using PEQ plus wringing the best SINAD out of my amp using direct mode has given me the best sound I’ve ever had. And given Wiim clearly have a plan to further develop / enhance its RC - Dirac, with its cost premium, now needs to catch up. I only use Dirac with my Arcam AVR390 for surround duties (where I think a lower SINAD is less noticeable).

You got me curious, could you explain/elaborate on that ”direct mode”?
Might that just be bypassing EQ in your Arcam amp perhaps, then there is still a ”non-direct mode” applied in Wiim as soon as you enable EQ/RC in the Wiim app resulting in SINAD and other nastiness.

I am also on the ASR train at least as much as possible since I have a +21db peak at 39Hz in my room that needs to go no matter what (EQ/DSP7Dirac) so I need to be flexible

 

[badunn]

My understanding of Dirac on the Arcam means I’m putting the analogue signal (from my SMSL C200 DAC optically connected to a Wiim pro) through the Arcam DACs… so not the cleanest route. And ASR slate the non direct inputs but give the direct inputs a relatively clean bill of health (for the AVR390 that is, and Stereophile confirmed the Arcam SR250 a clean ‘direct in’ too)

Don’t get me wrong… if Dirac was the only option I’d continue to use it as dealing with room acoustics is critical. I don’t believe though the Wiim RC and PEQ is adding as many SINAD nasties as the Arcam DACs do - and I genuinely believe I am listening to a cleaner sound (of course I can’t objectively demonstrate that but I have to trust my ears).

I’ve just been staggered with what I’ve achieved with the Wiim RC. And it’s free. And it’s going to be developed further. And it’s just a damn sight easier to use than Dirac.

 

[badunn]

While WiiM rc is an improvement it is not the same level of improvement as Dirac. An optional Dirac license would be a nice option. It would provide an improvement now that WiiM could/would eventually offer.

While WiiM rc is an improvement it is not the same level of improvement as Dirac. An optional Dirac license would be a nice option. It would provide an improvement now that WiiM could/would eventually offer.

I’m not just trying to be contrary but I’ve achieved a better sound with Wiim RC than Dirac. But that’s obviously just my opinion, and in my system. But Wiim have achieved so much with their RC and it’s just in its infancy. If Dirac was to be added as a £50 add on - maybe ok. But it’ll be £300, maybe slightly less, maybe slightly more. If it includes Bass Control then it’s £500. I’m guessing here. That’s too much an add on cost given what we are paying for the Wiim units. Again that’s just my opinion as others may be happy to pay that.

 

[Smartplug]

I’m not just trying to be contrary but I’ve achieved a better sound with Wiim RC than Dirac. But that’s obviously just my opinion, and in my system. But Wiim have achieved so much with their RC and it’s just in its infancy. If Dirac was to be added as a £50 add on - maybe ok. But it’ll be £300, maybe slightly less, maybe slightly more. If it includes Bass Control then it’s £500. I’m guessing here. That’s too much an add on cost given what we are paying for the Wiim units. Again that’s just my opinion as others may be happy to pay that.

Wiim is not done refining their rc. There will be independent peq rc, auto timing, auto level and multiple sweep that’s on the horizon.

 

[DG77]

Wiim is not done refining their rc. There will be independent peq rc, auto timing, auto level and multiple sweep that’s on the horizon.

I look forward to it!

And I dont believe Dirac to be the one ultimate solution, but it is one that is documented and can manage both phase/Time/level/volume adjustments and one can read how it is performed in hardware and software (minidsp etc.).

While the solutions in Eversolo and Wiim leaves me wondering what compromises are done to the signal using their software algorithms/conversions/resampling bitrates etc. It would be a interesting read if wiim could elaborate how it is done

 

[badunn]

I look forward to it!

And I dont believe Dirac to be the one ultimate solution, but it is one that is documented and can manage both phase/Time/level/volume adjustments and one can read how it is performed in hardware and software (minidsp etc.).

While the solutions in Eversolo and Wiim leaves me wondering what compromises are done to the signal using their software algorithms/conversions/resampling bitrates etc. It would be a interesting read if wiim could elaborate how it is done

Amir at ASR concluded in his Wiim pro plus review that with eq enabled (no parameters changed - set flat) there was no impact on SINAD. Whether that extends to full blown RC…?

 

[DG77]

Thats good to know!
Thanx

 

[merifon]

While the solutions in Eversolo and Wiim leaves me wondering what compromises are done to the signal using their software algorithms/conversions/resampling bitrates etc. It would be a interesting read if wiim could elaborate how it is done

Consider that the devastating effect of any average room not buit as purpose, it's far more worst than any modern and reasonable digital process.
It's not unusual to see hi end installations by "purists" lying in rooms that reverberate even in picture...

 

[DG77]

Consider that the devastating effect of any average room not buit as purpose, it's far more worst than any modern and reasonable digital process.
It's not unusual to see hi end installations by "purists" lying in rooms that reverberate even in picture...

Agreed!

It’s my audio OCD spooking me out!

FYI during last weekend I borrowed 5 different streamers to compare soundquality and DSP/EQ options, all connected digitally to my Dali Rubicon 6C (active speakers) ie bypassing any internal DAC’s inside the streamers.
Minidsp sdh studio
Eversolo dmp a6 master edition
Blusound node 132
Wiim ultra
Wiim pro

My usercase is getting rid of a +21db peak in the 40Hz while maintaining or improving on the sound quality compared to my wiim Pro while only using digital out and Tidal connect.

Short answer for me there was no clear winner when considering pricing and features I would never use or see (Lcds dont show inside a cabinet).

Without any EQ/DSP the top performers (would rate the difference to below streamers at 5-7% improvement) were the minidsp and eversolo, They had slightly wider image and clearer/more controlled sound without”harshness” (Harshness is an exaggeration none of the streamers sounded harsh).

Then it was all more of a preference of sound between the both wiims and the node, node slightly less ”Soft” and slightly better separation.
Wiim ultra was more akin to the node in it’s characteristics.

In the end I returned them all because I could not justify the price of the eversolo when half of it was for features I would not see or use, the minidsp did everything right but has to be connected to a pc for eq adjustments and the volumio interface it uses for streaming though it did not affect the sound was like something from the 90’s so not worth the price either. I would have bought it otherwise.

 

[badunn]

Agreed!

It’s my audio OCD spooking me out!

FYI during last weekend I borrowed 5 different streamers to compare soundquality and DSP/EQ options, all connected digitally to my Dali Rubicon 6C (active speakers) ie bypassing any internal DAC’s inside the streamers.
Minidsp sdh studio
Eversolo dmp a6 master edition
Blusound node 132
Wiim ultra
Wiim pro

My usercase is getting rid of a +21db peak in the 40Hz while maintaining or improving on the sound quality compared to my wiim Pro while only using digital out and Tidal connect.

Short answer for me there was no clear winner when considering pricing and features I would never use or see (Lcds dont show inside a cabinet).

Without any EQ/DSP the top performers (would rate the difference to below streamers at 5-7% improvement) were the minidsp and eversolo, They had slightly wider image and clearer/more controlled sound without”harshness” (Harshness is an exaggeration none of the streamers sounded harsh).

Then it was all more of a preference of sound between the both wiims and the node, node slightly less ”Soft” and slightly better separation.
Wiim ultra was more akin to the node in it’s characteristics.

In the end I returned them all because I could not justify the price of the eversolo when half of it was for features I would not see or use, the minidsp did everything right but has to be connected to a pc for eq adjustments and the volumio interface it uses for streaming though it did not affect the sound was like something from the 90’s so not worth the price either. I would have bought it otherwise.

Is there anything unusual about your listening space?

 

[DG77]

It’s 4 meters by 4.5meters which causes a rom mode at 38-40Hz.
Concrete walls all around