Respectful environment in documentation

[Pragmatist]

 

[onlyoneme]

Your reaction as a “community curator” makes me question whether the Wiim forum is a community I want to have any part in.

Let's start the terrorism of the political correctness.

 

[hgo58]

Let's start the terrorism of the political correctness.

This is a thread about finding alternative words, nothing else.

Some finds it amusing others not. That is fine.

What would you prefer for referencing the primary WiiM device and the devices linked to it?

 

[onlyoneme]

I'm perfectly fine with the master-slave terminology.

 

[harkpabst]

I'm perfectly fine with the master-slave terminology.

I personally agree with this. But not because it goes without saying, or because I think the idea behind the proposal is fundamentally wrong.

Instead, I have looked into the issue and given it my thoughts. In my opinion, the term ‘slave’ is actually harmless in a technical context. The term ‘master’ has different meanings in English anyway.

What I don't agree with at all is the way @hgo58 is being treated here. He is a respectable software developer and shows a degree of responsibility that software developers have not taken in the past (for example, when they ‘defined’ the kilobyte as 1024 bytes in a completely insane way and in contradiction to current standards).

It is perfectly legitimate to deal with the issue of language and discrimination. It may be uncomfortable and you may come to different judgements. But it is certainly no reason to make fun of those who call for this discussion.

 

[hgo58]

Thanks to @WiiM Team for updating the documentation and App on this subject.

 

[castalla]

I'm awake, still

 

[d6jg]

FFS
I used the terminology in its common usage format which in my head has absolutely no connection to the past that @hgo58 has connected it to.
If you drive a car and it has brakes then you will be very happy that the braking system has both a master and a slave cylinder! Get a fucking life!

 

[hgo58]

FFS
I used the terminology in its common usage format which in my head has absolutely no connection to the past that @hgo58 has connected it to.
If you drive a car and it has brakes then you will be very happy that the braking system has both a master and a slave cylinder! Get a fucking life!

Show some respect please.

Just because it's not important to you, it is to some other people and WiiM understood that.

 

[d6jg]

Show some respect please.

Just because it's not important to you, it is to some other people and WiiM understood that.

I suggest you show some intelligence. Slavery is and always was clearly wrong but the use of two words in an entirely different context is simply not connected.

 

[hgo58]

I suggest you show some intelligence.

Likewise.

If you are so much against showing respect, then maybe you shouldn't reply to this thread at all.

As I wrote before in the thread this wasn't raised for my own sake but because I know, after writing user documentation for the last 40 years, that it's a sensitive subject in some places of the world.

 

[harkpabst]

The forum rules are very liberal and don't ask for much. It should be very easy to obey to them.

Thread 'WiiM Forum Rules'

Mar 1, 2023

Hi, we appreciate everyone's comments and opinions and want this forum to be a place where people can discuss your thoughts, ideas, and suggestions about WiiM. Any posts unrelated to WiiM or pointed toward users in the forum will be taken seriously. We'll be going through the forum and removing posts that violate that. Moving forward we will warn and then remove the post. If you see anything too, please let us know. Thanks for everyone's cooperation. Below are general guidelines for participating in the forum.

Be kind and courteous
We're all in this together to create a welcoming...

• WiiM Team
• Replies: 5
• Forum: General WiiM Announcements

• 

I don't see how this ..

Get a fucking life!

I suggest you show some intelligence.

... is compliant. And it's completely unnecessary. There's nothing to protect here and nobody is forced into anything.

 

[castalla]

Where's the appropriate respect for transgender plugs, then?

 

[d6jg]

The forum rules are very liberal and don't ask for much. It should be very easy to obey to them.

Thread 'WiiM Forum Rules'

Mar 1, 2023

Hi, we appreciate everyone's comments and opinions and want this forum to be a place where people can discuss your thoughts, ideas, and suggestions about WiiM. Any posts unrelated to WiiM or pointed toward users in the forum will be taken seriously. We'll be going through the forum and removing posts that violate that. Moving forward we will warn and then remove the post. If you see anything too, please let us know. Thanks for everyone's cooperation. Below are general guidelines for participating in the forum.

Be kind and courteous
We're all in this together to create a welcoming...

• WiiM Team
• Replies: 5
• Forum: General WiiM Announcements

• 

I don't see how this ..


... is compliant. And it's completely unnecessary. There's nothing to protect here and nobody is forced into anything.

Yesterday I unknowingly used the offending words when giving a legitimate answer to a question here concerning a question about connecting to some powered speakers.

I apologise for swearing but I am not sure how I could have answered the question without these words.

The OED does not suggest that there is only one derivation of these words. They are in common use in various context eg vehicle braking systems.

 

[harkpabst]

Yesterday I unknowingly used the offending words when giving a legitimate answer to a question here concerning a question about connecting to some powered speakers.

I apologise for swearing but I am not sure how I could have answered the question without these words.

The OED does not suggest that there is only one derivation of these words. They are in common use in various context eg vehicle braking systems.

You don't have to explain that to me. I already stated that my personal opinion is rather to not let words be taken hostile in a particular sense that makes them generally unusable. I recognise that my opinion on this is not the only one that counts, though.

It looks like WiiM did find a way to explain things using different words in their FAQ. And it was probably easy, because the big tech companies have been through this debate years ago. It's really not a new topic and @hgo58 did not invent it.

All I ask is to keep any discussion civil. An honest apology is certainly a respectable move.

 

[Wiimer]

I understand that the master has been demoted to leader. But how should I call the child device from now on.

Follower
Others
Surround speaker

At least three terms are now in use. Should I use these differently depending on the situation?

 

[jmarket75]

I think that it would be good if the terms "master" and "slave" used i WiiM documentation and the WHA should be replaced with more inclusive and neutral language.

This could be:

**Primary/Secondary**,
**Leader/Follower**,
**Main/Replica**,
**Controller/Worker**,
**Parent/Child**,
**Manager/Agent**.

These alternatives would help create a more inclusive and respectful documentation/app.

The word "slave" is found in at least 8 FAQ documents and also in the WiiM Home App (Group Audio Delay). I would like to see a more consistent terminology where the word "slave" is not included.

What is the first thing that comes to your mind when you read master/slave in a document? Maybe you have the problem?

 

[claudia.bailey]

As a black chick writing on a white background, you know the ink is black, the page is white.
please get a life. Do you also want to remove Male and female when it comes to leads?
Seriously, I can't.

 

[hgo58]

What is the first thing that comes to your mind when you read master/slave in a document? Maybe you have the problem?

What is your problem? If you don't care then just ignore it, unless you want to provoke a new discussion.

WiiM agreed and the words has been changed.

 

[harkpabst]

@jmarket75, @claudia.bailey,

You are invited to read the entire thread before posting random comments.