32bit playback is garbled

[d6jg]

I have been digitising my large Vinyl collection for over 15 years and have used various ADC over time in conjunction with VinylStudio (and LMS).

IMHO VinylStudio is by far the best software for the job and LMS is by far the best audio server software I have ever used.

Based on this experience I have to say that I cannot discern any benefit in the bit/sample rate of Vinyl rips beyond 24/96 but I can definitely discern a difference between files created with a cheap ADC and those from a more expensive better built one.

My current ADC or more accurately USB Audio Interface will support 24/192 but my ears can’t.

Bearing in mind that there are no commercially available 32bit files if I was you I’d make 24bit FLAC versions of your files and park the 32bit WAV versions somewhere safe for the future. I’d opt for FLAC due to its better tagging support over WAV.

I haven’t yet got an Ultra and am debating with myself whether there would be any benefit over my current Raspberry Pi’s connected via USB to high end DACs.

 

[sscott]

I have been digitising my large Vinyl collection for over 15 years and have used various ADC over time in conjunction with VinylStudio (and LMS).

IMHO VinylStudio is by far the best software for the job and LMS is by far the best audio server software I have ever used.

Based on this experience I have to say that I cannot discern any benefit in the bit/sample rate of Vinyl rips beyond 24/96 but I can definitely discern a difference between files created with a cheap ADC and those from a more expensive better built one.

My current ADC or more accurately USB Audio Interface will support 24/192 but my ears can’t.

Bearing in mind that there are no commercially available 32bit files if I was you I’d make 24bit FLAC versions of your files and park the 32bit WAV versions somewhere safe for the future. I’d opt for FLAC due to its better tagging support over WAV.

I haven’t yet got an Ultra and am debating with myself whether there would be any benefit over my current Raspberry Pi’s connected via USB to high end DACs.

I understand what you are saying and in fact I started with 24bit and 96k sampling. However, I was not using my current unit.
I have been ‘searching’ for the best (for me) sound for years and I am really close.
I know that I can use a mastering grade DAC such as RME and have it controlled by a Pi - I have done that - its not pretty but functional.
WiiM says it can do 32bit at 192k and I am going to keep trying and working with WiiM and in hopes check for sound between the Ultra and my RME.
I have had direction from several audio engineers for the movie industry to get to where I am today - close but no cigar - but close.
Just really want to hear the Ultra do 32bit.
That being said, I have not tried the RME at 24bit and it seems I should. To your point; ADCs do make a difference.
What stereo system do you listen to?

 

[d6jg]

I understand what you are saying and in fact I started with 24bit and 96k sampling. However, I was not using my current unit.
I have been ‘searching’ for the best (for me) sound for years and I am really close.
I know that I can use a mastering grade DAC such as RME and have it controlled by a Pi - I have done that - its not pretty but functional.
WiiM says it can do 32bit at 192k and I am going to keep trying and working with WiiM and in hopes check for sound between the Ultra and my RME.
I have had direction from several audio engineers for the movie industry to get to where I am today - close but no cigar - but close.
Just really want to hear the Ultra do 32bit.
That being said, I have not tried the RME at 24bit and it seems I should. To your point; ADCs do make a difference.
What stereo system do you listen to?

I’m not in your league hardware wise.
I’m currently running an Onkyo CP-1050 wearing a 2M Blue into a Behringer UHD204. Previously I have used a basic UAC202 to create 16/44.1 FLACs which sounded OK and also a Mixer with USB support to create 16/44.1 FLACs. These sounded similar but 16/44.1 FLACs created with the UHD204 sound much cleaner and clearer with no change in the TT and Cart. I gradually stepped up to 24/96. All the stuff I read on the subject says that the human ear can’t discern any differences above this level and in truth 24/48 should be sufficient.
IMO the higher quality of the UHD204 is the differential not the bit/sample rate.
I have recently upgraded my main amp to a Mission 778x which has USB input to an ESS Dac chip rated for 32/768. I’m using a Pi 4 directly connected to the USB and to my ears it’s quite a bit better than a WiiM Pro using its onboard DAC.
I’m still of the view that Squeezelite does not support 32bit.

 

[sscott]

I’m not in your league hardware wise.
I’m currently running an Onkyo CP-1050 wearing a 2M Blue into a Behringer UHD204. Previously I have used a basic UAC202 to create 16/44.1 FLACs which sounded OK and also a Mixer with USB support to create 16/44.1 FLACs. These sounded similar but 16/44.1 FLACs created with the UHD204 sound much cleaner and clearer with no change in the TT and Cart. I gradually stepped up to 24/96. All the stuff I read on the subject says that the human ear can’t discern any differences above this level and in truth 24/48 should be sufficient.
IMO the higher quality of the UHD204 is the differential not the bit/sample rate.
I have recently upgraded my main amp to a Mission 778x which has USB input to an ESS Dac chip rated for 32/768. I’m using a Pi 4 directly connected to the USB and to my ears it’s quite a bit better than a WiiM Pro using its onboard DAC.
I’m still of the view that Squeezelite does not support 32bit.

Sounds like a fine system indeed.
I just do not know personally where Lyrion supports or does not support 32bit.
I dont see whether Lyrion is a factor, but, I simply do not know. A question I will put to the Lyrion forum.
I am waiting to hear from WiiM on this, they have answered but want some 32bit files but I cannot upload them as they are too large.
Oh well.

 

[mlsstl]

I am waiting to hear from WiiM on this, they have answered but want some 32bit files but I cannot upload them as they are too large.
Oh well.

Perhaps use a Dropbox setup for the file transfer?

 

[sscott]

Perhaps use a Dropbox setup for the file transfer?

Thanks, still waiting to hear from WiiM on how to give them some of my files to test as they had no trouble playing 32bit through Lyrion.
I hope this gets sorted soon.

 

[slartibartfast]

Thanks, still waiting to hear from WiiM on how to give them some of my files to test as they had no trouble playing 32bit through Lyrion.
I hope this gets sorted soon.

Did you read this?

32bit WAVE files Little endian do not play on LMS - any tips? - Squeezebox : Community : Forums

Know everything about Pear Cables v.s. The Amazing Randi? This is your forum.

forums.slimdevices.com

Are your files floating point or integer?

 

[Brantome]

WiiM says it can do 32bit at 192k and I am going to keep trying and working with WiiM and in hopes check for sound between the Ultra and my RME.

I’m sure I’ve read somewhere (probably in this forum) that WiiM’s statement of supporting 32/384 was in relation to the Ultra’s internal DAC being used to convert that to an analog signal, not when outputting over digital where the DAC isn’t used. Similarly, WiiM devices’ digital output maxes out at 24/192 so a 32/192 file on input (if supported) may well be output at 24/192 over digital.

 

[Brantome]

UPDATE:
Apparently you CANNOT use the ULTRA USB to go to an external DAC.....

I can as of this morning when my firmware was updated to the beta that does support it, like my Amp already does on its beta firmware

 

[onlyoneme]

Similarly, WiiM devices’ digital output maxes out at 24/192 so a 32/192 file on input (if supported) may well be output at 24/192 over digital

And it's outputted as 24 bit indeed. 32 bit RME test file passes bit perfect test for 24 bits.

 

[canard]

despite the needs of headroom, given the needs of vinyl even 20bits will be sufficient,..then 24 bits will be of course even more..it's done it's done...but 32bits is more handicapping weight, possibility of exchanges , not read by much other than anything else, in this specific case...
on the other hand the use of a nice adc like your rme is well seen....but not so much linked to the resolution adopted etc

(ps we have perspective on the phono part of your carver? It may therefore be offset in quality compared to your effort on the rme...)


sorry

 

[d6jg]

Sounds like a fine system indeed.
I just do not know personally where Lyrion supports or does not support 32bit.
I dont see whether Lyrion is a factor, but, I simply do not know. A question I will put to the Lyrion forum.
I am waiting to hear from WiiM on this, they have answered but want some 32bit files but I cannot upload them as they are too large.
Oh well.

@sscott I see that you posted earlier in the month at Alpinesoft on the subject where Paul replied basically saying that 24bit was more than sufficient. You may be chasing a rabbit that doesn't exist.

 

[sscott]

Did you read this?

32bit WAVE files Little endian do not play on LMS - any tips? - Squeezebox : Community : Forums

Know everything about Pear Cables v.s. The Amazing Randi? This is your forum.

forums.slimdevices.com

Are your files floating point or integer?

slartibartfast, it is 32bit floating. Will read the post, thanks.

 

[sscott]

slartibartfast, it is 32bit floating. Will read the post, thanks.

Just read the long and detailed post; how do you use the ‘-w’ option so I can try.
Do understand 24 vs 32 bit rabbit hole but still want to try for myself.
Thanks!

 

[Brantome]

Just read the long and detailed post; how do you use the ‘-w’ option so I can try.
Do understand 24 vs 32 bit rabbit hole but still want to try for myself.
Thanks!

If that’s a squeezelite option, you can’t apply it on WiiM

 

[d6jg]

If that’s a squeezelite option, you can’t apply it on WiiM

It is indeed a Squeezelite command line switch. I can't really say there is a case for WiiM to add -w but definitely a case to allow a user to specify the -s setting.

 

[sscott]

It is indeed a Squeezelite command line switch. I can't really say there is a case for WiiM to add -w but definitely a case to allow a user to specify the -s setting.

Clearly, I need to read with greater detail….