Best practice for creating a local library: DLNA? Folder structure?

[Underbridge]

Hi all. I'm planning to buy a WiiM Amp Ultra. I have a local MP3 library ripped from CDs stored on a NAS, but I want to recreate it in lossless FLAC to use with the new WiiM. I thought I would ask the community for guidance before I get too far along.

As I am starting from scratch, what is the best practice way of serving up the library to the WiiM? Should I use DLNA, or something else? The WiiM would be the main/only consumer of it. The NAS is old and due for replacement - Netgear ReadyNAS Duo V2. It doesn't support modern security protocols but it apparently has DLNA. I'll get a new one at some point, so that will have up to date features. As an interim step, I could just dump the library onto a drive plugged into the WiiM's USB port until then.

Also, the library structure. I have started using Exact Audio Copy, configured for lossless conversion according to guides I found online. I am ripping into a structure that looks like this:

• Artist 1
  • Album 1
    • Track 1.flac
    • Track 2.flac
    • Track N.flac
    • Cover.jpg
  • Album 2
    • Track 1.flac
    • Track 2.flac
    • Track N.flac
    • Cover.jpg
• Artist 2
  • etc.

EAC also creates a cue file and log file for each CD, which I have left there. EAC populates the main metadata tags, including CD Title, CD Artist, Year, Genre, Track Title, Composer.

The cover artwork JPG that EAC finds is usually 1400x1400, sometimes smaller.

Do I want artwork as a separate JPG like this, or embedded in the files? Not sure if EAC also embeds it, or how to tell.

Is the above the usual way? Is there anything else I should be doing or capturing to give the best experience?

I know the WiiM screen is small, but I might use the WiiM app on a Chromecast with Google TV to display artwork etc. on a nearby screen, and am looking forward to having that capability.

Any help is appreciated, thanks.

 

[Aquaman]

If you're only just starting and are serious about it this is going to be longer journey with errors and learning loops. In order to cut some corners here your-'re on the right track by seeking advice. But try to understand what is being suggested and don't rely on it blindly before you get to work. There isn't the ONE solution, so you'll have to figure out which is the right one for you.

Let's start with ripping and file formats. You say you have some mp3 file but that you want to play them as flac files over the WiiM. You can certrainly convert the mp3 files to flac or convert them on the fly during playback, but that won't get you anywhere - the content will still be no better than what's currently in your mp3s. You cannot recover lost information by converting into a lossless format. You need to re-rip your CDs directly to flac or any other lossless file format in order maintain the full file information.

Otherwise FLAC is good. It's a lossless but packed format and thus saves disc space and transfer time whenever you copy it somewere else. Also it is fully taggable, other than WAV for instance.

Save your cover art as you have already described as a separate JPG file in the album folder. I would call them folder.jpg though. This is recognized by all applications I know of, cover.jpg on the other hand may not be accepted by some.
I keep my JPGs at no larger than 800x800 pixels and below 600kB file size. Again, a saftey measure for all-round compatibility.
Only on mixed albums that you have compiled yourself (e.g. The Best of the 90ies) I use embedded covers as each track will have its own.

I don't know what EAC uses the cuesheets for. Those might lead to double entries on scanning the library later. Maybe someone else can advise on this. I use Foobaar2000 for ripping and tagging with to occasional suppoert of MP3Tag.
The log files are not really good for anything unless you want to prove to someone that you have a bit perfect rip. I wouldn't bother with them.

As for tagging I will give you an example for classical music and a mixed album at that. This is more or less the 'worst case' you will have in tagging. For regular Rock, Pop, Jazz it it much simpler, but you can still apply the same routine.

My ‚physical‘ storage, i.e. folder structure, is simple and consistent across my complete library, be it classical or not. Album Artist —> Album.
Please note that I wrote 'Album Artist' not 'Artist'. Eventhough this will be the same for most popular music it makes a decivive difference for compilation albums and also classical.

Album Artist: Berliner Philharmoniker
Artist (per track): Mozart; Grieg; Prokofiev (last name only) ---> for popular music: I do not use the composer's last name but the same as the Album Artist (e.g. ABBA)
Composer (per track): Mozart, Wolgang Amadeus; Grieg, Peer; Prokofiev, Sergei (<last name, first name>) ---> for popular music: I usually omit this
Genre: Classical - Strings
Album: Mozart - Eine Kleine Nachtmusik, Grieg, Prokofiev (Karajan, 1982)>
<Last name of the (major) composer - Name of the Album (Conductor, Year of album publication or recording)
---> for popular music: <Name of the Album (Year of album publication or recording, Year of re-release/re-mastering)
Track Title (per track) (example): KV 525 - Eine Kleine Nachtmusik - I. Allegro
Track no.
Year (per track): <Year of release> or <Year of debut performance>
Publisher: <Record Lable>
Source: eg. „Lossless 44.1/16 - CD rip“ or „MP3 320/16 - Shareware“

I do not use TOTAL TRACKS, CD, TOTAL CDs. This is useless info, not good for anything. Double CDs get joined to one album. There's no need to follow the physical restriction of CDs.

The broad album description for classical albums is intended to support the search function (if ever I need it) and also to give me a good overview in the album lists.

The file names of the tracks are ALWAYS: ARTIST - TRACKTITLE

Further on to DLNA.
A NAS IS not 'compatible with DLNA'. It has to RUN a DLNA (UPnP) server. Most free DLNA servers are crap. Most of them cannot even render Album Artist browse trees. Instead they use Artist, which is just wrong. The good ones like Plex and Minim Server will cost you.
Plus not all servers can be installed an all NAS types. A very basic but solid DLNA server is Linn Kazoo, if you must use DLNA.

If you are considering the purchase of a new NAS take a look at QNAP and/or Synology. Both can run LMS (Lyrion) as a server. This is not DLNA, it's using its own protocol. But it is supported by your WiiM and it is far superior to any DLNA server. Please do your own search on this topic, e.g. on the ASR forum.

Good luck!

 

[Underbridge]

Thanks Aquaman for your detailed reply. Very interesting, though as most of the music is not classical I won't have all of these considerations.

A few comments and further questions.

On the basic library structure:
File names. Why do you include Artist in the name - "ARTIST - TRACKTITLE"?
Metadata tagging. I think what I have started doing will be fine - famous last words? If I decide to change it retrospectively, I could edit it later, which might be tedious but not impossible.

Server:
I didn't mention DLNA "compatibility". Since posting, I have verified that the DLNA server on my ancient NAS delivers up the basic info and album cover to an app I installed on my phone to test it out (mconnect). And, importantly, it plays the music!



I do need a new NAS, and I'll look into Lyrion and its benefits over DLNA. Last time I looked at NAS options, I was unimpressed with Synology's tactic of locking users in to using only Synology drives. But based on today's experiment I think the old NAS will work for now.

 

[Aquaman]

Thanks Aquaman for your detailed reply. Very interesting, though as most of the music is not classical I won't have all of these considerations.

A few comments and further questions.

On the basic library structure:
File names. Why do you include Artist in the name - "ARTIST - TRACKTITLE"?
Metadata tagging. I think what I have started doing will be fine - famous last words? If I decide to change it retrospectively, I could edit it later, which might be tedious but not impossible.

Server:
I didn't mention DLNA "compatibility". Since posting, I have verified that the DLNA server on my ancient NAS delivers up the basic info and album cover to an app I installed on my phone to test it out (mconnect). And, importantly, it plays the music!

View attachment 28451

I do need a new NAS, and I'll look into Lyrion and its benefits over DLNA. Last time I looked at NAS options, I was unimpressed with Synology's tactic of locking users in to using only Synology drives. But based on today's experiment I think the old NAS will work for now.

Well, you seem to be quite happy as it is. So good for you! Like I said in the intro of my previous post, it is entirely up to you what you make of the advice you see, hear or read from others. Sometimes it's just a detail that you pick up and use for yourself.

Yes, metadata can of course be changed retrospectively as you please.

Why ARTIST - TRACKTITLE? Simple, for unique identification.
Let's take the song Hallelujah. I have three versions of this same song by different artist:

Cohen, Leonard - Hallelujah.flac
Lang, KD - Hallelujah.flac
Canadian Tenors, The - Hallelujah.flac

Plus other titles, that are also named Hallelujah but are different songs:

Peacock Palace - Hallelujah.flac
Westernhagen, Marius Müller - Hallelujah.flac

 

[simbun]

As I am starting from scratch, what is the best practice way of serving up the library to the WiiM? Should I use DLNA, or something else? The WiiM would be the main/only consumer of it

If you want to use the WiiM Home app (WHA) then your options are either DLNA or Plex (Lyrion isn't compatible with the WHA).

Also, the library structure. I have started using Exact Audio Copy, configured for lossless conversion according to guides I found online. I am ripping into a structure that looks like this:

• Artist 1
  • Album 1
    • Track 1.flac
    • Track 2.flac
    • Track N.flac
    • Cover.jpg

I use the same folder structure (one folder per album, not per disc) but name my files %discnumber%.%tracknumber%.flac because I'll never browse by folder, but as long as they're unique it's fine.

EAC also creates a cue file and log file for each CD, which I have left there. EAC populates the main metadata tags, including CD Title, CD Artist, Year, Genre, Track Title, Composer.

CUE sheets can contain information that isn't available from the ripped files so I'd definitely keep them e.g. pre-emphasis flag, track 1 pregap e.t.c.

Do I want artwork as a separate JPG like this, or embedded in the files? Not sure if EAC also embeds it, or how to tell.

Artwork should be stored as folder.jpg. Tagging programs such as foobar2000 and Mp3tag (more user friendly) allow you to view and edit tags and artwork.

Is the above the usual way? Is there anything else I should be doing or capturing to give the best experience?

You certainly have the basics covered. If you wanted to enrich your browsing experience (would require a different server) you ought to consider adding additional metadata through foobar2000/Mp3tag/Musicbrainz Picard e.g. release type and original release date.

 

[simbun]

Last time I looked at NAS options, I was unimpressed with Synology's tactic of locking users in to using only Synology drives. But based on today's experiment I think the old NAS will work for now.

I think Synology have reversed that decision, but the damage to their reputation has already been done. Having said that, if I were in the market for a NAS I'd probably use them.

 

[Underbridge]

Thanks @simbun.

Lyrion isn't compatible with the WHA

Great to know! My brief search tells me that options are Material plugin, and then use a browser on a phone, or to use an app (iOS in my case). For the benefit of other users in the house as well as me, I prefer the minimum number of phone apps (ideally 0!) and for them to be as simple as possible. Is control possible via the WiiM's touch screen?

I'm still to do my homework on Lyrion benefits though.

I use the same folder structure (one folder per album, not per disc) but name my files %discnumber%.%tracknumber%.flac because I'll never browse by folder, but as long as they're unique it's fine.

Aha - so browse by folder will show folder and file names, but browse by artist uses metadata tags? I'm new at this.

Artwork should be stored as folder.jpg

Noted, and is what @Aquaman already said. I'll change to this.

You certainly have the basics covered.

Phew!

 

[Aquaman]

Great to know! My brief search tells me that options are Material plugin, and then use a browser on a phone, or to use an app (iOS in my case). For the benefit of other users in the house as well as me, I prefer the minimum number of phone apps (ideally 0!) and for them to be as simple as possible. Is control possible via the WiiM's touch screen?

I'm still to do my homework on Lyrion

Yes, either material skin in your browser or on iPhones/Pads iPeng. This one is really great. Basically it‘s free, but can purchse the playback option for a very moderate price. This way the phone can act as a player. Comes in handy in the summer when your sitting in the garden with earphones.

Aha - so browse by folder will show folder and file names, but browse by artist uses metadata tags?

Exactlly.

 

[d6jg]

There is more to Lyrion than you might have uncovered. It has plugins for a lot of additional audio services - Qobuz, Tidal, Spotify, BBC Sounds, Radio Paradise etc - which, with Material, allows you to control everything in one place. You only need the WHA to set up the WiiM and then everything is via Material on whatever device(s) you want.

If your ReadyNAS still adequately provides its base purpose - file serving - then you could keep it but install Lyrion onto a Raspberry Pi (no Linux skills required) and point it at the files in your NAS.

You will need to re-rip to FLAC so explore dbPoweramp as an alternative ripper - it’s worth the cost - and I’d recommend you use ReplayGain tags from the start. Also use a file naming convention that includes discno and trackno with leading zeros e.g. 01-01-She Loves You.flac - this will ensure that tracks are displayed correctly in all cases. Don’t embed artwork unless you find you need to but instead use folder.jpg in the album folder. I’d also opt from Artist/Album structure.

 

[Aquaman]

Disk and track no. in a file name - hmmmm.

The tracks on an album consisting of two CDs with 20 tracks each can easily be numbered 1-40 omitting the CD no. info. Why transfer the physical limitation of CDs to files and folders? It‘s still one album - on both media.

Leading track nos in file names only serve a purpose if your browsing/playing in the order of file names. Only the most stupid audio implementations cannot read the TRACK tag nowadays.

None of it does any harm but I think it’s ugly.

 

[d6jg]

Disk and track no. in a file name - hmmmm.

The tracks on an album consisting of two CDs with 20 tracks each can easily be numbered 1-40 omitting the CD no. info. Why transfer the physical limitation of CDs to files and folders? It‘s still one album - on both media.

Leading track nos in file names only serve a purpose if your browsing/playing in the order of file names. Only the most stupid audio implementations cannot read the TRACK tag nowadays.

None of it does any harm but I think it’s ugly.

If you translate to 1-40 then that will also work. Many keep discno to continue a differentiation between discs for when you have the original album on CD1 and bonus tracks on CD2 or an example like this (although you can achieve this with 1-40 numbering)

 

[Aquaman]

If you translate to 1-40 then that will also work. Many keep discno to continue a differentiation between discs for when you have the original album on CD1 and bonus tracks on CD2 or an example like this (although you can achieve this with 1-40 numbering)

View attachment 28459

Jup, I was only just waiting for such an example . And I have a fair few of those. I actually put them all in one album=folder and give the tracks an addition in the file and track names like … - Live.

 

[d6jg]

Jup, I was only just waiting for such an example . And I have a fair few of those. I actually put them all in one album=folder and give the tracks an addition in the file and track names like … - Live.

If you do that then Music & Artist Information (MAI) - a key Lyrion plugin - will likely fail to look up track lyrics correctly. If you must you can put it in brackets (Live) as MAI ignores stuff in brackets but IMHO it is best to keep the title in its original form.

There are still plenty of examples of pieces of software that don't order files correctly without discno-trackno. Bear in mind that non audio related software will almost always order alphanumerically. I don't know about you but I use things like WinSCP to look at files on my NAS a lot. This has no concept of tag based ordering.

 

[Aquaman]

If you do that then Music & Artist Information (MAI) - a key Lyrion plugin - will likely fail to look up track lyrics correctly. If you must you can put it in brackets (Live) as MAI ignores stuff in brackets but IMHO it is best to keep the title in its original form.

There are still plenty of examples of pieces of software that don't order files correctly without discno-trackno. Bear in mind that non audio related software will almost always order alphanumerically. I don't know about you but I use things like WinSCP to look at files on my NAS a lot. This has no concept of tag based ordering.

The use of MAI is a very valid consideration. Thank you. It‘s just that I‘m not using this, nor the lookup of lyrics. So I never gave that a thought.

When it comes to file viewing and file management I use foobar2000 which can be configured in every thinkable way.

Of courseFB2K also has the usual routines for mass tagging or file re-naming. I‘m probabably only using 10% of what it has on offer and still it’s a ton of features I utilze.

 

[slartibartfast]

The use of MAI is a very valid consideration. Thank you. It‘s just that I‘m not using this, nor the lookup of lyrics. So I never gave that a thought.

When it comes to file viewing and file management I use foobar2000 which can be configured in every thinkable way.

Of courseFB2K also has the usual routines for mass tagging or file re-naming. I‘m probabably only using 10% of what it has on offer and still it’s a ton of features I utilze.

Some prefer to use "Music Folder" in LMS. Then the leading zero in track numbers makes sense.

 

[Underbridge]

I'm realising I'm about to go down another rabbit hole. Lyrion looking up lyrics - that does sound cool, but do I need it? I won't answer that right now because I don't know the answer. It was only yesterday that I thought a simple file share of FLAC files rather than MP3 was all I needed.

 

[Aquaman]

I'm realising I'm about to go down another rabbit hole. Lyrion looking up lyrics - that does sound cool, but do I need it? I won't answer that right now because I don't know the answer. It was only yesterday that I thought a simple file share of FLAC files rather than MP3 was all I needed.

Like I said initially, this will be a longer journey.
But it‘s fun.Enjoy it!

 

[slartibartfast]

I'm realising I'm about to go down another rabbit hole. Lyrion looking up lyrics - that does sound cool, but do I need it? I won't answer that right now because I don't know the answer. It was only yesterday that I thought a simple file share of FLAC files rather than MP3 was all I needed.

Not only lyrics but album reviews and artist biographies as well.

 

[Underbridge]

So Lyrion can replace use of the WHA. Surely this is only in relation to selection of audio input. If I want to change EQ presets or anything like that, I (or other victims of my decisions) would still need to use more than one app... or possibly the WiiM remote.

 

[Aquaman]

So Lyrion can replace use of the WHA. Surely this is only in relation to selection of audio input. If I want to change EQ presets or anything like that, I (or other victims of my decisions) would still need to use more than one app... or possibly the WiiM remote.

For that you‘ll need the WiiM Home app.