Finally got my Fiio k11r2r dac

[85mk7]

You can use a subwoofer and still have independent left/right room correction. Currently not possible with USB out (and we'll have to see if it's ever going to work reliably, not an easy task).

You can use the subwoofer output in combination with the coaxial (or optical) digital output. This is currently not possible with USB out.

Good Point.

I thought USB may would be the best way to go for - but that let me think twice.

I got a sub - at the moment connected to the sub out on the Wiim.

If i use a dedicated AMP like ZA3 - could i connect the sub to the AMP, as far as i use the Volume Control on the ZA3, right?

What If i dial the ZA3 Volume fader at a e.g. kinda fixed medium to 3/4 range while controlling the volume with the volume control by the Wiim Ultra, cause its comfortable with the remote..

Will the sub react to the volume changes as well or is that a Kind of "stupid" idea?
Should i go the coax way instead when using a sub?

Actually i dont have a DAC planned - but who knows, may i will try such a dedicated DAC some day.

 

[Poultrygeist]

I came very close to buying the k11 R2R but instead ordered a Fosi ZD3 DAC. The Fosi is a few dollars cheaper since it's currently on sale and I didn't need another headphone amp as I have a Topping DX3 Pro+. Main attractions of the ZD3 is that it has HDMI ARC, a remote and will output from both XLR and RCA's simultaneously. The latter is a nice feature if you bi-amp. Another reason I considered both DAC's is that they both use a 12v power supply ( not so common these days ) and I happen to have a nice 12v linear regulated PSU which I'm anxious to use.

 

[harkpabst]

I got a sub - at the moment connected to the sub out on the Wiim.

If i use a dedicated AMP like ZA3 - could i connect the sub to the AMP, as far as i use the Volume Control on the ZA3, right?

Yes, you must use the volume control on the device the subwoofer is connected to. That's the only way to ensure that the sub and the main speakers' volume remains in balance when changing the overall volume.

The ZA3 does have a subwoofer output, but if you connect your subwoofer this way you are losing all the benefits of WiiM's fantastic subwoofer management. There will be no high pass filtering of the main speakers. When I read the measurements correctly, the ZA3 subwoofer output has a fixed, non-configurable low pass filter at 200 Hz for the sub, which is rather undesirable. Depending on the upper frequency you select on the sub they could interfere. You'd really be giving up one of the Ultra's absolute killer features.

What If i dial the ZA3 Volume fader at a e.g. kinda fixed medium to 3/4 range while controlling the volume with the volume control by the Wiim Ultra, cause its comfortable with the remote..

Will the sub react to the volume changes as well or is that a Kind of "stupid" idea?

No, the sub will not react to volume changes when using the WiiM Ultra's volume control. The sub will always play at the level determined by the ZA3. => Stupid idea, indeed.

Personally, I think the ZA3 is one of the less attractive offerings on the market unless you are for (relatively) cheap maximum power (in double mono config). For reasons nobody but the manufacturer knows, they did not implement Post Filter Feedback (PFFB) with the ZA3, like they did with the V3 Mono. This results in the output impedance not being constant over frequency and the frequency response of the speakers varying in the same manner. Admittedly, the same is true e.g. for the WiiM Amp (not the WiiM Amp Pro which implements PFFB), but at least WiiM still managed to squeeze slightly better performance out of the WiiM Amp than the ZA3 has to offer. See here:

Fosi Audio ZA3 Amplifier Review

This is a review and detailed measurements of the Fosi Audio ZA3 stereo amplifier with balanced XLR inputs. It was sent to me by the company and costs US $149.99 with 48 volt power supply. The amplifier has really dressed up from its earlier origins of common enclosures in budget class...

www.audiosciencereview.com

WiiM Amp Streaming Amplifier Review

This is a review and detailed measurements of the WiiM Amp streaming amplifier. It was sent to me by the company and costs US $299. I was pleasantly surprised by the good bit of weight this small box has. It will help it not slide with the weight of the speaker wires and such. Back panel shows...

www.audiosciencereview.com

Should i go the coax way instead when using a sub?

Actually i dont have a DAC planned - but who knows, may i will try such a dedicated DAC some day.

As long as you're not using an external DAC you don't have to worry, obviously. USB out is generally considered technically superior to S/PDIF (coaxial or optical), while opinions differ on if this should make a perceivable difference with a quality DAC. But if you want to keep using the Ultra's smooth and easy subwoofer integration you would have to use coax or optical, indeed.

WiiM say they are working on a solution for subwoofer support with USB output, but this really isn't easy, because the advantage of USB out (the receiving DAC handles the clocking of the signal) is just what makes synching an analogue subwoofer output so hard.

 

[Wiimer]

The ZA3 does have a subwoofer output, but if you connect your subwoofer this way you are losing all the benefits of WiiM's fantastic subwoofer management. There will be no high pass filtering of the main speakers.

Sorry if I misread your excellent post, but if you connect the sub to the ZA3, you will not lose the high pass of the main speakers if the Ultra subwoofer setting is on. The only thing you lose is the low pass of the sub .

But in any case that is not ideal.

Edit: Of course, in practice it is pointless to turn on the Ultra subwoofer setting when a sub is connected to the ZA3.

 

[harkpabst]

Sorry if I misread your excellent post, but if you connect the sub to the ZA3, you will not lose the high pass of the main speakers if the Ultra subwoofer setting is on. The only thing you lose is the low pass of the sub .

But in any case that is not ideal.

You got me. But there will be no subwoofer output at all when using USB out, right? In this case you are really effectively losing the ability to connect a subwoofer directly.

 

[Wiimer]

You got me. But there will be no subwoofer output at all when using USB out, right? In this case you are really effectively losing the ability to connect a subwoofer directly.

Yes, you are correct.

I just wanted to add that "you can enable the high pass on the main speakers even if you don't connect anything to the Ultra's sub out".

However, if both the main speakers and the sub are connected to the ZA3, then turning on the Ultra's subwoofer setting is pointless because it will not send bass below the crossover value to the ZA3.

Thus, I regret any unnecessary meddling here .

 

[harkpabst]

Thus, I regret any unnecessary meddling here .

Your intervention has been as helpful and adequate as always. We should be precise when giving advice.

 

[85mk7]

Thanks for your feedback regarding that aspect into the last detail *thumbs up*

I will continue using the Wiim Sub Out for sure as long as i use the internal DAC of the Wiim...
If i consider changing my setup at any time, i would prefer the coaxial way to maintain the sub out features by the Wiim Ultra.

The ZA3 will replace a much smaller Fosi Amp (Fosi Audio V1.0B) i used before and i think it will be more than enough power for my little bookshelf speakers. It's a quite minimal setup so the ZA3 including the 12V trigger looks like a good companion for me on paper and in terms of budget/quality aspect. Surely there are better options - but at the moment iam quite happy and think that the ZA3 will be okayisch.

The V1.0B will move into another room and playing more or less a backup role afterwards.

As DAC i had the K11 R2R by Fiio in mind - but not sure if it's really necessary at all - it's more being curious as i am a technical nerd But every tool more in the living room makes my woman kinda unhappy, so i have to be careful too with any additional hardware staying around

 

[harkpabst]

The ZA3 will replace a much smaller Fosi Amp (Fosi Audio V1.0B) i used before and i think it will be more than enough power for my little bookshelf speakers. It's a quite minimal setup so the ZA3 including the 12V trigger looks like a good companion for me on paper and in terms of budget/quality aspect. Surely there are better options - but at the moment iam quite happy and think that the ZA3 will be okayisch.

Power will be plentiful, that's no issue at all. I also acknowledge that the ZA3 can be had really cheap. But if you are interested in getting the best sound quality from you minimalist system and even plan to replace the excellent DAC in your Ultra with something else, why go cheap on the power amp?

Until WiiM might come up with some amp to suit Ultra owners (please, please), I would rather go with the 3e Audio A5se:

3e Audio Next-gen A5 A7 Stereo-Mono-HiFi-Verstärker mit verbesserter professionellem PFFB TPA3255 TPA3251 Verstärker - AliExpress

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www.aliexpress.com

Not as cheap as the ZA3 and less maximum power, but clearly cleaner measurements and pretty much no load dependency. If you can stretch your budget a little, the non-se 3e Audio A5 is even better into lower loads.