Problem Ultra + Echo Show 15 Preferred Speaker

[192khz]

Hi All,
I'm new to WIIM and the forum, this is my first post and really appreciate some help.

I have an Ultra + Vibelink in a group with an Echo Show 15 but it's behaving very strange.

Previously used an Amp Pro instead of the Ultra and everything worked fine with Alexa voice commands and preferred speaker.

Now when I ask Alexa to play music it won't play on the preferred speaker (Ultra) it just goes straight to the Show. But oddly Alexa's response to the command will play through the speakers e.g. "now playing a mix for you". Also if I ask the Show to play BBC Sounds it plays through the Ultra and main speakers.

I've updated firmware/software, deregistered/reregistered, relinked Amazon Music in WH app, rebuilt the room in Alexa app etc.

Any help much appreciated.

 

[Wiimer]

I'll let you know the outcome.
Thanks again

This may not be related to your issue, but could you open Ultra's device settings in the WiiM app and check "Amazon alexa settings"?

"Amazon Alexa Laungage" is your country and language selected correctly?
(Is this setting the same as for other WiiM devices?)

 

[192khz]

Yes all of my Wiim devices are set correctly

 

[192khz]

Hi,

An update regarding this issue.

From Wiim support:

'Our engineers have checked your feedback logs before and found that the problem is related to the Alexa server. We suspect that your device may have been blacklisted by the server'.


Why this is potentially the case I'm not certain and getting anything from Amazon customer support is extremely difficult.

 

[Burnside]

If it were actually blackisted, then I’d doubt you would have been able to register the show to your Amazon/alexa account at all.

Can you set any other Echo as preferred speaker? Or another WiiM device? Is it just the Ultra that won’t play ball? Can you get hold of another Ultra to try that? Or even return it to the retailer and see if they’ll replace it?

I appreciate that Amazon first line support can be difficult to get on board and I would have hoped WiiM could have progressed this with Amazon on your behalf given their contacts there. You could always ask Amazon to formally open a ticket to their Alexa specialists and see if they will take it on board.

I’m scratching my head with this issue to be honest.

 

[192khz]

I originally had a Grouped Amp Pro and Echo 15 which streamed AMU from the Wiim when the Echo 15 was issued a command to play music. So in this case the Amp Pro was preferred speaker and it worked as expected.

The Ultra was running HDMI from my TV into an amp but I switched the Wiims around. Amp Pro for the TV and the Ultra plus a new Vibelink for dedicated music. Occasionally I would run the AM app on the TV to play music and never really tried any network streaming with the Ultra, until the switchover.

It was at this point I discovered it didn't work.

I think you're right about the blacklist, from what I've read it wouldn't be possible to register the device, but it does seem like there's something blocking this device from the Amazon music side. The Ultra actually works as preferred speaker with BBC Sounds when issuing command to the Echo 15.

And yes it really does seem that it's just the Ultra that doesn't work. Can't really get hold of another unless I buy a new one, and I'm now very reluctant to buy any more Wiim products or Amazon devices for that matter.

I was hoping Wiim could have done more, I'll try Amazon again but not expecting much.

 

[192khz]

It's also the same if I bypass the Echo 15 entirely and use the Wiim remote to issue an Alexa command - it doesn't work.

 

[Wiimer]

I originally had a Grouped Amp Pro and Echo 15 which streamed AMU from the Wiim when the Echo 15 was issued a command to play music. So in this case the Amp Pro was preferred speaker and it worked as expected.

The Ultra was running HDMI from my TV into an amp but I switched the Wiims around. Amp Pro for the TV and the Ultra plus a new Vibelink for dedicated music. Occasionally I would run the AM app on the TV to play music and never really tried any network streaming with the Ultra, until the switchover.

It was at this point I discovered it didn't work.

I think you're right about the blacklist, from what I've read it wouldn't be possible to register the device, but it does seem like there's something blocking this device from the Amazon music side. The Ultra actually works as preferred speaker with BBC Sounds when issuing command to the Echo 15.

And yes it really does seem that it's just the Ultra that doesn't work. Can't really get hold of another unless I buy a new one, and I'm now very reluctant to buy any more Wiim products or Amazon devices for that matter.

I was hoping Wiim could have done more, I'll try Amazon again but not expecting much.

Amazon can restrict some features of a user account, but I can't imagine what is locked in your case.

You may have already done this, but have you checked your Amazon account services?

Is Ultra listed under 'Devices' and 'Amazon Login Management' in Amazon Account Services?

If it is listed, it may be worth deleting and re-registering it.

 

[Burnside]

What subscription do you have for Amazon Music Unlimited? Again, I'm thinking that maybe if it were a single user subscription, that might not like the use of a preferred speaker, although again I'd be surprised if you could use that sub with a single WiiM device. And you did have it working with your WiiM Amp Pro.

What's your WiiM ticket number?

@RyanWithWiiM - can we get more info on this supposed blacklisting as it doesn't make sense, and can't your techies liaise with Amazon on this given the good relationship they had when bring Alexa and Amazon Music HD support to WiiM devices? I'm really running out of straws to clutch here despite being immersed with Alexa for years...

 

[192khz]

Amazon can restrict some features of a user account, but I can't imagine what is locked in your case.

You may have already done this, but have you checked your Amazon account services?

Is Ultra listed under 'Devices' and 'Amazon Login Management' in Amazon Account Services?

If it is listed, it may be worth deleting and re-registering it.

Yes it appears as a registered device and I've gone through deregistering reregistering process a few times, every element of the entire setup from the beginning. Can't find the section for Amazon Login Management' in Amazon Account Services.

 

[192khz]

Does the Amazon Music app see the Ultra and is it able to cast to it using AlexaCast, the round cast icon?

What subscription do you have for Amazon Music Unlimited? Again, I'm thinking that maybe if it were a single user subscription, that might not like the use of a preferred speaker, although again I'd be surprised if you could use that sub with a single WiiM device. And you did have it working with your WiiM Amp Pro.

What's your WiiM ticket number?

@RyanWithWiiM - can we get more info on this supposed blacklisting as it doesn't make sense, and can't your techies liaise with Amazon on this given the good relationship they had when bring Alexa and Amazon Music HD support to WiiM devices? I'm really running out of straws to clutch here despite being immersed with Alexa for years...

Yes the Ultra is visible as a device in the AM app. I can connect to it but the streaming fails and a message says 'something went wrong please try again later'. Although it will stream AM from the WHA (not by voice but by manual track selection).

I have AMU individual plan so not tied down to a single device (plus full prime account).

Ticket number is: 537258

 

[Wiimer]

Can't find the section for Amazon Login Management' in Amazon Account Services.

At the bottom of your account service you will find a 'Data Management' section. Within that you will find an admin section that allows Ultra to access the Alexa Voice Service. (Sorry, I don't know the exact name of the section in English.)

 

[192khz]

I did find a section which indicates Alexa Voice Service is connected to the Ultra.

 

[192khz]

The guys over at Wiim support said:

'I recommend deleting all existing groups in the Alexa app and then recreating them. This may help resolve the issue and allow the WiiM Ultra to function properly as the Preferred Speaker'.

Which I have tried and rebuilt only the specific Ultra/ Echo Show 15 group, including clearing the Alexa app cache and storage, but it didn't work. I also then tried it using an Echo Dot but that didn't work either.

Out of interest and just to reconfirm I built a group consisting of the Echo Show 15 and the Amp Pro (which is physically situated in a different room) and when asking the Show 15 to play music it laid off the stream to the Amp Pro as expected.

 

[Burnside]

The guys over at Wiim support said:

'I recommend deleting all existing groups in the Alexa app and then recreating them. This may help resolve the issue and allow the WiiM Ultra to function properly as the Preferred Speaker'.

Which I have tried and rebuilt only the specific Ultra/ Echo Show 15 group, including clearing the Alexa app cache and storage, but it didn't work. I also then tried it using an Echo Dot but that didn't work either.

Out of interest and just to reconfirm I built a group consisting of the Echo Show 15 and the Amp Pro (which is physically situated in a different room) and when asking the Show 15 to play music it laid off the stream to the Amp Pro as expected.

I know it won’t have access to your unlimited account, but could you deregister an echo and the ultra and set them up again under a different Amazon account, maybe one under an Amazon Household/ family setup so that you can share at least Amazon Music Prime? I don’t think it would matter if you only changed the Alexa login in the WiiM home app and left the Amazon music credentials as they are for your main account. If you can’t do it under an Amazon household, then try even a brand new Amazon account with just Amazon music free and see if the issue is more with the Ultra or your Unlimited account?
This is indeed a very peculiar bug…

 

[192khz]

Not sure this is possible from what I've read multiple Amazon accounts are apparently not allowed. Also read it's not possible to share the AM Prime

 

[Burnside]

Amazon music prime (but not unlimited) is a shareable benefit with another adult account in an Amazon Household/Family - see https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/help/customer/display.html?nodeId=GWZ7QXD2X8WL8YE8

See here on how to set up an Amazon Household (now called Amazon Family): https://www.amazon.co.uk/hz/profilepicker/amazonfamily/learn

I have that set up and primarily use the second account to test, or to order more of an item when I’ve hit a limit on the first account. The second account even has the same main address and payment method as the first. There’s really nothing stopping you having multiple Amazon accounts that I’ve ever come across.

I’m just suggesting further steps I’d take to try to get to the bottom of what is a very strange issue - is it an issue with your Amazon account, Amazon music subscription or in fact the Ultra? Having a second account - either one in an Amazon household with shared Amazon Music prime or an entirely separate account with just Amazon music free - and a re-registered echo and the Ultra would allow testing in a “new” environment to try and isolate the issue.

One thing we haven’t mentioned I don’t think - are these devices all sharing the same network and SSID? Again, it shouldn’t matter but it’s something else to rule out.

 

[Wiimer]

Not sure this is possible from what I've read multiple Amazon accounts are apparently not allowed. Also read it's not possible to share the AM Prime

I have read this thread from the beginning and it appears that group playback has not yet been tested.

1) Link Ultra and pro in the WiiM app and connect to Pro via AlexaCast from the Amazon music app. Will music play on both Ultra and Pro?

2) Create a speaker group (multi-music group) for Ultra and Pro in the Alexa app. Does the music play on both Ultra and Pro when the group is played using voice control?


This test will not solve your problem, but may give an indication of whether there is a issue with Ultra.

 

[Wiimer]

Please try @Burnside's suggestions first.

 

[192khz]

I've looked into the network and SSID.
Its never been a problem before, the Pro for instance is on 5Ghz and the Echo on 2.4Ghz and works fine.

I can't rename the SSID in the router to make it easy to clearly separate the bands when connecting the devices but I have managed to get the Ultra and ES15 on the same 2.4Ghz SSID and confirmed in the detailed network settings info (I know it'd be preferable on the 5Ghz).



I'll give the suggestions a try but it'll probably be later this weekend before I get chance.
Many thanks

 

[192khz]

Hello

So this is what I've done:

*Opened a new Amazon account with Amazon music free and new email address.

*Reregistered the Ultra and ES15 I to the new account.

*Logged into WHA, AM app and Alexa app with the new account.

*Grouped the Ultra and ES15 in Alexa app.

*Told Alexa to play music and it worked!

*Also linked the Ultra and Pro in WHA and the grouped devices played music simultaneously.

So it works with Alexa voice on ES15, WHA manual selection and Wiim voice remote control, but casting and / or connecting to a device from AM app doesn't seem possible with the free account.

The setup for preferred speaker in the Alexa app provided the correct options for grouping and choosing speaker output. The attached image shows the original account and the option was output from the Ultra when speaking to the Ultra!?

So it would seem there's something wrong with my original Amazon account.