Signal Chain Degradation?

[AudioAmore]

Hello! I'm in the process of upgrading my entire system from scratch, and had a few questions about incorporating my WiiMs into it.

Currently, my set up is:

Cd Transport and DAC into WiiM Pro Plus via optical
Phono stage into the same WiiM via RCA
Then, that WiiM into the amp via optical

From there, I'm able to stream to the other WiiMs across my house.

For my new system, I am interested in adding my components individually into the amp. However, this will impact my ability to sync and stream via WiiM. In another thread, I thought I might be able to get a second WiiM and add that to my amp for streaming, then run the WiiM Pro Plus via the pre-out on the amp so I can then sync. But It appears there will be some sync issues, so it doesn't look like that will be a viable option.

So my question is: How much of a signal degradation am I experiencing by using my current setup, specifically running my CD transport/DAC via optical and the phono stage via RCA into the WiiM, then optical OUT to the amp? Does the WiiM do any resampling even if I'm not using the internal DAC? And is the phono stage being processed because it's using RCAs in?

Subquestion: would an Ultra provide any signal benefits over the Pro Plus in this scenario?

Sub Subquestion: If I run a WiiM ultra into my DAC via USB, would that change anything, quality-wise?

Thank you for your patience in reading through this mess! I appreciate any help you can give!

 

[Mr Ee]

The wiim rca input (phono) will be digitised. The plus has decent adc processing; imo you'd not be losing anything, esp. from a phono input
The optical in may be altered depending on your settings, e.g. EQ applied, volume changed, max/fixed sample rate selected.
Once again, imo, not an issue.

The Ultra uses a different chip for ADC. Per wiim: "The ADC chip is better [than pro plus] in the WiiM Ultra using TI PCM1863."
How much better? No idea!

Ultra usb out to dac - generally considered to be highly dependent on your dac.

Pragmatically, I believe any potential differences going via the wiim are far outweighed by the simplicity, convenience and multiroom capabilities it provides.

You mention cd transport and dac.
The dac won't be feeding into the wiim via optical, so I'm not sure what you mean here.

 

[dangermouse]

You mention cd transport and dac.
The dac won't be feeding into the wiim via optical, so I'm not sure what you mean here.

Yeh, that had me scratching my head also.

 

[AudioAmore]

The wiim rca input (phono) will be digitised. The plus has decent adc processing; imo you'd not be losing anything, esp. from a phono input
The optical in may be altered depending on your settings, e.g. EQ applied, volume changed, max/fixed sample rate selected.
Once again, imo, not an issue.

The Ultra uses a different chip for ADC. Per wiim: "The ADC chip is better [than pro plus] in the WiiM Ultra using TI PCM1863."
How much better? No idea!

Ultra usb out to dac - generally considered to be highly dependent on your dac.

Pragmatically, I believe any potential differences going via the wiim are far outweighed by the simplicity, convenience and multiroom capabilities it provides.

You mention cd transport and dac.
The dac won't be feeding into the wiim via optical, so I'm not sure what you mean here.

First of all, I apologize for my coffee-fueled mistake. I totally misrepresented my signal chain when I said the DAC was connected via optical. I am, indeed, running my CD transport into the WiiM via optical, the phono stage into the WiiM via RCA, and then out from the WiiM to my DAC via the optical. From there, I am going from the DAC to the amp via coax. My Bad!

As for the rest, I appreciate your feedback. This is precisely the information I was looking for. I do want to weigh the multiroom against any nominal signal improvement. I've fallen deep into the rabbit hole, thinking more about granular hypotheticals than real-world experience! Thank you for bringing me back from the edge!

As always, I truly appreciate your knowledge and willingness to help!

 

[AudioAmore]

Yeh, that had me scratching my head also.

Yup. Totally misspoke. In reality, I'm feeding my CD transport into the WiiM via optical in, my phono stage into the WiiM via RCA, and then feeding the WiiM to my DAC via the optical out. From the DAC I'm going to the amp via coax. Sorry about the confusion!

 

[Mr Ee]

No worries!
By mentioning a dac I assumed you were going from wiim to dac to amp. But you never know... many amps have a dac and you may have been using that instead of the plus's dac.

You can, of course, try bypassing the wiim to see if you can tell any difference.
I'd be quite surprised if you could / if it was significant. But I won't tell you you won't / couldn't possibly!

Admittedely not on my 'best' setup, and not prolonged / critical listening, but some time ago I compared:
- mini, optical to RME dac, rca to amp
- mini, optical to RME dac, rca to ultra, rca to amp (i.e. ultra analog in, adc at 24/96, dac, analog out)
Sounded the same to me. Putting the ultra in the middle didn't make me even think about needing to take it out.

The rabbit hole is deep.
Sometimes you just need to stick your head out and enjoy the music instead!

 

[d6jg]

Yup. Totally misspoke. In reality, I'm feeding my CD transport into the WiiM via optical in, my phono stage into the WiiM via RCA, and then feeding the WiiM to my DAC via the optical out. From the DAC I'm going to the amp via coax. Sorry about the confusion!

If you are connecting the DAC by coax to your amp what exactly is the DAC doing? Isn’t the digital to analogue conversion now being carried out by the Amp which presumably must have a DAC chip? Or am I missing something?

 

[AudioAmore]

The rabbit hole is deep.
Sometimes you just need to stick your head out and enjoy the music instead!

This is the truth!!

Thanks for sharing your experiences and thoughts. I really appreciate you taking the time to comment. I will do some playing around, but, like you said, it’s time to enjoy the music!

Thanks again!

 

[AudioAmore]

If you are connecting the DAC by coax to your amp what exactly is the DAC doing? Isn’t the digital to analogue conversion now being carried out by the Amp which presumably must have a DAC chip? Or am I missing something?

GEEZE!!! What the heck is wrong with me????

DAC to amp via XLR. Balanced out from DAC and balanced in to amp.

At this point I should just retire typing thumbs.

And I would suggest you forget you ever read any of my blathering!!

I apologize and I thank you.