TIDAL MQA unfolding coming to WiiM Mini ?

[happywiimer]

Is TIDAL MQA unfolding coming to WiiM Mini?

It was on the roadmap, then disappeared, now under future but no timeline

 

[WiiM Team]

Yes, we are integrating MQA into WiiM Mini.

For this kind of streamer product, we will add a user option to disable the MQA Core Decode and just authenticate MQA streams and pass the MQA stream bit perfectly to the S/PDIF output. This is useful when the connected device is a Full MQA Decoded as it can perform the complete Decode. Performing the Core Decode to a digital output is good when the connected device only supports MQA Rendering or has no MQA support.

 

[happywiimer]

Yes, we are integrating MQA into WiiM Mini.

For this kind of streamer product, we will add a user option to disable the MQA Core Decode and just authenticate MQA streams and pass the MQA stream bit perfectly to the S/PDIF output. This is useful when the connected device is a Full MQA Decoded as it can perform the complete Decode. Performing the Core Decode to a digital output is good when the connected device only supports MQA Rendering or has no MQA support.

Thanks @WiiM Team !

 

[TTC64]

HI WIIM team,
could you explain how MQA will work with
a) Bitperfect digital forwarding?
b) Multiroom streaming ?
and are you aware that with a focus on MQA addition for approx 300k Tidal user, which is about a 0,05% market share of the world streaming markets, you may lose more users than you can actually win?
You may see it as another option, but there is a valid opposition out in the markets (due to the lies surrounding MQA) who sees it as a no-go. The financial situation of both Tidal and MQA may as well not be very promising.
Source: https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/topic/30381-mqa-is-vaporware/?do=findComment&comment=1220741
Best TTC64

 

[happywiimer]

and are you aware that with a focus on MQA addition for approx 300k Tidal user

Where did you get this number from?

 

[TTC64]

Where did you get this number from?

Did you reply (and edited the reply) before you reached the end of my reply?

 

[happywiimer]

Did you reply (and edited the reply) before you reached the end of my reply?

The forum post is from some random guy who writes "My current estimate is about 300,000 users"

I guess I would ask him the same question - did you already ask him ?

 

[TTC64]

I may understand that the sheer information buried in a 1k pages thread is a bit too much to dig for you and most MQA-sayers, I knew the thread owner as an industry verteran and owner of an tax accountancy with decades of experience.
I've shared some projects with him in the past, thus I trust his accountability ...
For questioning him you should look at the informations he is citing as available from Companies House, analyze them and challenge him with your findings (if differnet from his).
IMHO, he wouldn't post figures he can't proof, and perhaps you shouldn't question them if you can't proof different ...
I know it's the internet ... but ...

 

[happywiimer]

Yeh sorry but everything is vague in that guy's post (regarding his 300k guesstimate).

So I see you've just copied his 300k number without seeing his calculation yourself.

Ultimately it is clear to all of us that WiiM want to support all streaming options.

Kudos to WiiM for this goal.

Just enjoy the music, however you stream.

 

[onlyoneme]

What's the difference if it's 3M, 300k, 300 or just 3 here? I don't get it.

 

[happywiimer]

What's the difference if it's 3M, 300k, 300 or just 3 here? I don't get it.

I don't get pulling numbers out of thin air either.

And as I wrote above:

Ultimately it is clear to all of us that WiiM want to support all streaming options.

Just enjoy the music, however you stream.

 

[TTC64]

What's the difference if it's 3M, 300k, 300 or just 3 here? I don't get it.

I would guess that most companies with business plans allocate ressources to targets that inhibit projected market shares, especially when the product development involves customer related services.
The Tidal market share looks (according to information based on Companies House records, analyzed and reported from the source in my first post) seems in reality to be significant smaller than the loud shout outs that demand for it.
If you look at the sources and your analysis results in that your not betting on a dying horse, excellent ...
In my case, I like the company Linkplay a lot, the strategy I can see behind the WIIM mini and the WIIM Pro, and especially the idea behind their developing efforts, and I just hope that they don't mis-allocate their ressources for an unsucessful service/gadget that will almost not or only minimal translate in any sales success.
Neither engineer nor accountant here, but educated in finance/business planning.

And @happywiimer: Now that you got the sources, do your homework, present a result that's different and I accept your challenge. Without that, all your accusations of thin air are at least unfounded and as you put it "a bit vague", imho.

 

[onlyoneme]

I would guess that most companies with business plans allocate ressources to targets that inhibit projected market shares, especially when the product development involves customer related services.
The Tidal market share looks (according to information based on Companies House records, analyzed and reported from the source in my first post) seems in reality to be significant smaller than the loud shout outs that demand for it.
If you look at the sources and your analysis results in that your not betting on a dying horse, excellent ...
In my case, I like the company Linkplay a lot, the strategy I can see behind the WIIM mini and the WIIM Pro, and especially the idea behind their developing efforts, and I just hope that they don't mis-allocate their ressources for an unsucessful service/gadget that will almost not or only minimal translate in any sales success.
Neither engineer nor accountant here, but educated in finance/business planning.

And @happywiimer: Now that you got the sources, do your homework, present a result that's different and I accept your challenge. Without that, all your accusations of thin air are at least unfounded and as you put it "a bit vague", imho.

But you've made a strong mis-allocate assumption here "are you aware that with a focus on MQA addition for approx 300k Tidal user, which is about a 0,05% market share of the world streaming markets, you may lose more users than you can actually win?"
We do not know if Linkplay's work on MQA solution really affects other areas.
The same story with PEQ, Roon support and other quite "exotic" capabilities. A big deal for a highly limited number of users, irrelevant for most of them.
Business is a constant decision-making process. We do not know what's the intended primary target of Mini/Pro related activities, is it a market share, good sales figures or maybe just positive audiophiles reception.

 

[TTC64]

But you've made a strong mis-allocate assumption here "are you aware that with a focus on MQA addition for approx 300k Tidal user, which is about a 0,05% market share of the world streaming markets, you may lose more users than you can actually win?"
We do not know if Linkplay's work on MQA solution really affects other areas.
The same story with PEQ, Roon support and other quite "exotic" capabilities. A big deal for a highly limited number of users, irrelevant for most of them.

I would assume that there is a sufficient market share of users that avoid products that carry MQA logo and service (independent of the notion if that is in reality a proven disadvantage), when there are DAC mnfs that offer both, MQA and non MQA versions of their products.
Connect this with a shrinking customer base of Tidal users and you may see from where this assumption come from. The MQA discussion since 2016 had left many consumers without any sympathy for the product, as many souvereign customers may not like to be lied to or being belittled in social networks by Peter Veth.
I can't proof but fear, that the MQA logo doesn't help for sales .. the math will be done later ...
And we have not yet started any technical discussion about the advantage/disadvantage of MQA.
I think it isn't necessary either for making a strategic decision, but it may help to provide arguments in the decision process. (see LINN)

 

[TTC64]

big deal for a highly limited number of users, irrelevant for most of them.

I agree with that, but I would as well assume that allocation of system ressources on the WIIM board are physically limited as well. So why waste them ? With the ROON example the numbers are perhaps equally small, but their ressources are almost infinite compared to the WIIM device

 

[happywiimer]

And @happywiimer: Now that you got the sources, do your homework, present a result that's different and I accept your challenge. Without that, all your accusations of thin air are at least unfounded and as you put it "a bit vague", imho.

Sorry - the onus is on you. You came quoting 300k and cannot explain yourself where this number comes from.

Anyway your posts are off topic of this thread.

Please start a separate thread to discuss how many MQA users there are.

 

[WiiM Support]

HI WIIM team,
could you explain how MQA will work with
a) Bitperfect digital forwarding?
b) Multiroom streaming ?
and are you aware that with a focus on MQA addition for approx 300k Tidal user, which is about a 0,05% market share of the world streaming markets, you may lose more users than you can actually win?
You may see it as another option, but there is a valid opposition out in the markets (due to the lies surrounding MQA) who sees it as a no-go. The financial situation of both Tidal and MQA may as well not be very promising.
Source: https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/topic/30381-mqa-is-vaporware/?do=findComment&comment=1220741
Best TTC64

Hi TTC64, please find the replies to your questions below.
a) Yes, it provides the bit perfect output via the digital audio port;
b) Multiroom streaming in our current firmware is still limited to 48 kHz, 16-bit. We'll provide the bit perfect multiroom streaming in future.

MQA is a feature requested by many of our existing users thus we believe it's important to support it. We don't expect we'll lose users just by supporting a feature some of them don't need. Please let us know what use cases are important to you so we can take this into count.

 

[WiiM Support]

I would guess that most companies with business plans allocate ressources to targets that inhibit projected market shares, especially when the product development involves customer related services.
The Tidal market share looks (according to information based on Companies House records, analyzed and reported from the source in my first post) seems in reality to be significant smaller than the loud shout outs that demand for it.
If you look at the sources and your analysis results in that your not betting on a dying horse, excellent ...
In my case, I like the company Linkplay a lot, the strategy I can see behind the WIIM mini and the WIIM Pro, and especially the idea behind their developing efforts, and I just hope that they don't mis-allocate their ressources for an unsucessful service/gadget that will almost not or only minimal translate in any sales success.
Neither engineer nor accountant here, but educated in finance/business planning.

And @happywiimer: Now that you got the sources, do your homework, present a result that's different and I accept your challenge. Without that, all your accusations of thin air are at least unfounded and as you put it "a bit vague", imho.

Thanks TTC64. Got your point and appreciate it!

 

[TTC64]

Hi TTC64, please find the replies to your questions below.
...
Please let us know what use cases are important to you so we can take this into count.

@WiiM Support
I had been a happy camper with the performance I've had during July & September, because my needs aren't special.
Qobuz, UPNP/DLNA and bitperfect digital throughput are awesome enough for me.
I created some blog entries about the WIIM, between May and End of September.

Update - WIIM mini HD Streamer - a success story

Update - WIIM Mini Streamer: The WIIM Mini Streamer is a cheap - puck sized - device for streaming Hi-Res Audio up to 192kHz/24bit from your home network or mobile phone to your DAC or preamp. It is a budget wise investment for multiroom scenarios - think BlueSound Node or Sonos. Plus, it is easi...

audiophilestyle.com

Would be very interested to review the WIIM pro, too. If interested please contact me via PM.

A point of interest could be 24-bit/352,8kHz capability bc it would allow DXD as well as DOP, if implemented.
But I agree, that's perhaps minority (audiophile) interest. Not sure at all, if the platform can deliver that.

The most important quality option for your product in my view is enhancing the quality of the Android/IOS app and perhaps allowing a functional use via HTTPS not only limited to Chromebook environment.
Searching the library and creating playlists are to name.
Please continue your impressive work !
Tom
To the OP, Sorry for offtopic conversation ;-)

 

[kevinek]

I just got my update