While streaming via Airplay, the app shows 256kbps bitrate only?

[DariuszP]

I am a new user / member, so let me use this opportunity to say hallo to everybody! I have just purchased WiiM Mini - it is really an impressive tiny device!

I have the following problem however: when streaming to the WiiM via Airplay (from iPhone, MacBook, AppleTV - tried all), the app shows that this stream is at 16/44 @ 256kbps (as per screenshot attached). And this is for Apple Music as well as any other content I stream via Airplay. I checked all the settings (both on WiiM app and on the source devices) and I believe all is setup properly and should send music in max. quality available for Airplay protocol (for best Apple Music files: ALAC 24/48 I guess?), but apparently it does not? My main concern is this 256kbps (16/44 I could live with).
Have you encountered such problem? Is there a quick fix for this?

Many thanks for your help!

My best regards

Darek

My setup is: WiiM Mini connected via Optical to DAC-40 card in Accuphase amp.

 

[LvdB]

Plot twist!

Just downloaded the Deezer App and started to stream via AirPlay 2 to my Wiim Pro and guess what? A 900kbps stream…

 

[merifon]

So, Apple music castrates itself…

 

[LvdB]

It definitely doesn’t look good. Still, there is always the option the Wiim displays the wrong information. Any idea how we can check with Wiim if they can troubleshoot?

 

[Brantome]

Plot twist!

Just downloaded the Deezer App and started to stream via AirPlay 2 to my Wiim Pro and guess what? A 900kbps stream…

View attachment 2073

Maybe not that different to Qobuz then as reported in the audiophilestyle link in comment #26 which was bit perfect. It’s primarily Apple Music that’s the mess, although the Tidal test they also mention wasn’t bit perfect either but that’s maybe down to that being messed up by MQA content.

 

[Brantome]

It definitely doesn’t look good. Still, there is always the option the Wiim displays the wrong information. Any idea how we can check with Wiim if they can troubleshoot?

As I often respond, you can raise a ticket with WiiM thru the feedback section in the WiiM Home app, attaching your screenshot. They’ll be able to inspect your device logs and see if the 900kbps is correct or not.

Also, is there a particular reason why you’re using Airplay for Deezer rather than logging in to Deezer in the WiiM Home app and playing from there? That will take Airplay out of the picture and produce better results.

 

[LvdB]

Well, mainly for the User Experience. I was hoping for Deezer Connect to work with the Wiim Pro but it didn’t (yet). (Should it work?) Then, using Deezer native on the Wiim Pro, I saw that the bitrate fluctuated between tracks so I got curious and tested the AirPlay function in the Deezer iOS App with the above result.

 

[Brantome]

Well, mainly for the User Experience. I was hoping for Deezer Connect to work with the Wiim Pro but it didn’t (yet). (Should it work?) Then, using Deezer native on the Wiim Pro, I saw that the bitrate fluctuated between tracks so I got curious and tested the AirPlay function in the Deezer iOS App with the above result.

Fair enough. Deezer Connect isn’t really a Connect mechanism like Spotify Connect which hands over the stream to the device being cast to, it’s little more than a remote control for a Deezer app running on another device. Consequently, it doesn’t fit into the WiiM environment as that’s using the Deezer third party API, not running the Deezer app.

Bitrate does fluctuate between tracks as it depends on the content that’s compressed within the FLAC file, in roughly the same way as jpegs differ in size even though they were taken on the same camera (not the best comparison I know as jpeg compression is lossy while FLAC isn’t but hopefully you get the gist).

Back to the 900 figure though - that might be a display bug that you should report as suggested above.

 

[Bismarck]

Yeah, and in the latter case “only if the system-wide AirPlay device is set. If AirPlay device only selected in the Music app, the output is NOT bit perfect.”

OT
And what about Amazon Music?
If an AirPlay 2 device, such as Wiim Pro, or even Airport Express, is selected, will the output be bit perfect?

 

[onlyoneme]

OT
And what about Amazon Music?
If an AirPlay 2 device, such as Wiim Pro, or even Airport Express, is selected, will the output be bit perfect?

Streaming to WiiM via AirPlay 2 doesn't seem to be bit perfect, regardless of the streaming platform or service you use.

 

[canard]

Fair enough. Deezer Connect isn’t really a Connect mechanism like Spotify Connect which hands over the stream to the device being cast to, it’s little more than a remote control for a Deezer app running on another device. Consequently, it doesn’t fit into the WiiM environment as that’s using the Deezer third party API, not running the Deezer app.

Bitrate does fluctuate between tracks as it depends on the content that’s compressed within the FLAC file, in roughly the same way as jpegs differ in size even though they were taken on the same camera (not the best comparison I know as jpeg compression is lossy while FLAC isn’t but hopefully you get the gist).

Back to the 900 figure though - that might be a display bug that you should report as suggested above.

true..
;-)
the 900k is just the real flow of the flac with some compression.. we can find sometimes stronger compressions at deezer... the irony is that it is not related to the requirement of the music... we will find a mickael jackson at 1440..and a symphony with quite strong compression...probably algorithms judging from the "demand" not from the nature of the music...

 

[DariuszP]

Streaming to WiiM via AirPlay 2 doesn't seem to be bit perfect, regardless of the streaming platform or service you use.

And this is perfectly fine for me - I understand that whatever is transmitted via Airplay would be converted = not bit perfect. My problem is that it is not converted to ALAC (i.e. lossless, but this is not equal to "bit perfect"), but apparently to AAC (which means conversion to a sort of mp3 = serious downsampling). What is particularly strange is that the native ALAC files (like those from Apple Music or ripped to ALAC by myself) are treated this way, while apparently these could be just streamed "as is".

 

[onlyoneme]

And this is perfectly fine for me - I understand that whatever is transmitted via Airplay would be converted = not bit perfect. My problem is that it is not converted to ALAC (i.e. lossless, but this is not equal to "bit perfect"), but apparently to AAC (which means conversion to a sort of mp3 = serious downsampling). What is particularly strange is that the native ALAC files (like those from Apple Music or ripped to ALAC by myself) are treated this way, while apparently these could be just streamed "as is".

Downsampling can happen anyway as AirPlay limits the resolution to 44.1/16. And that's the secret behind AirPlay 2 why AAC is so often chosen over ALAC...

 

[Brantome]

Downsampling can happen anyway as AirPlay limits the resolution to 44.1/16. And that's the secret behind AirPlay 2 why AAC is so often chosen over ALAC...

And as widely reported e.g. in the links I provided, this is an open secret and has often been discussed

 

[onlyoneme]

And as widely reported e.g. in the links I provided, this is an open secret and has often been discussed

We discuss it all the time, your link is a number 1 in the popularity category, but we still don't know why

 

[DariuszP]

We discuss it all the time, your link is a number 1 in the popularity category, but we still don't know why

And as widely reported e.g. in the links I provided, this is an open secret and has often been discussed

Apparently this is not that simple - I have risen this as an official ticket to WiiM Support and they did not have an instant answer for me (such as suggested by Brantome) and they have proposed to investigate this and revert to me. So apparently they do not know "why" either?

 

[Brantome]

Apparently this is not that simple - I have risen this as an official ticket to WiiM Support and they did not have an instant answer for me (such as suggested by Brantome) and they have proposed to investigate this and revert to me. So apparently they do not know "why" either?

Guess it depends on exactly what you asked and how they interpreted it. Plus in this case, the WiiM device is just an airplay receiver dealing with whatever it has been sent - all the manipulation of lossless into aac or whatever is done by the sender over which WiiM have no control.

 

[LvdB]

Checked some other forums and 256kbps is what you get with AirPlay 2 streaming from any Apple Music App.

 

[Brantome]

Checked some other forums and 256kbps is what you get with AirPlay 2 streaming from any Apple Music App.

It would appear those other forums are not aware of MacOS and the system-wide airplay device setting mentioned above and confirmed by several users which does support lossless ALAC over Airplay 2.

 

[LvdB]

I’m talking about streaming directly from any Apple Music App. And they do know this is different with steaming from a system: https://support1.bluesound.com/hc/en-us/community/posts/4405223632023-Apple-Music-Hi-Res-Lossless-

 

[Blundie]

According to this article from Darko, I guess we could ask WiiM to let us set Airplay mode to "Airplay 1" rather than "Airplay 2" to get a cd quality stream?