WiiM Amp blows NAD M10v2

L

layer9

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Apr 12, 2024
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Hi,

I recently bought both the WiiM Amp and NAD M10v2 for testing both:

View attachment IMG_6955.jpeg

Long story short: I‘ll go with the WiiM Amp and will sell the NAD.

Although the NAD has Dirac Live I am able to achieve the same soundstage using WiiMs EQ which is also much easier to use. Measuring the room with the NADs microphone did not make much difference so I had to manually edit the EQ for my room anyway.

What really is annoying is that the NAD constantly drops out of the network. A few hours after going to standby the NAD just disappears from my network and I have to unplug power in order to restore access.

I am driving a pair of Elac Vela BS 404.2 with the amplifiers and both perform very well - and there is actually no difference between the NAD (Hypex nCore) and the WiiM with its Texas Instruments power amplifiers as long as no EQ is used. Volume gain is good on both with my speakers (87db).

I only use AirPlay 2 for steaming music from my iPhone so I can’t say much about the BlueOS app from the NAD. However it looks polished and fast, so this might be the only area in which the NAD can compete with the WiiM.

Bottom line is that from my point of view the WiiM just blows a product that is almost 10 times the price of the WiiM Amp. I will sell the NAD and keep the WiiM!

Cheers
Michael
 
layer9 said:
Hi,

I recently bought both the WiiM Amp and NAD M10v2 for testing both:

View attachment 6419

Long story short: I‘ll go with the WiiM Amp and will sell the NAD.

Although the NAD has Dirac Live I am able to achieve the same soundstage using WiiMs EQ which is also much easier to use. Measuring the room with the NADs microphone did not make much difference so I had to manually edit the EQ for my room anyway.

What really is annoying is that the NAD constantly drops out of the network. A few hours after going to standby the NAD just disappears from my network and I have to unplug power in order to restore access.

I am driving a pair of Elac Vela BS 404.2 with the amplifiers and both perform very well - and there is actually no difference between the NAD (Hypex nCore) and the WiiM with its Texas Instruments power amplifiers as long as no EQ is used. Volume gain is good on both with my speakers (87db).

I only use AirPlay 2 for steaming music from my iPhone so I can’t say much about the BlueOS app from the NAD. However it looks polished and fast, so this might be the only area in which the NAD can compete with the WiiM.

Bottom line is that from my point of view the WiiM just blows a product that is almost 10 times the price of the WiiM Amp. I will sell the NAD and keep the WiiM!

Cheers
Michael
Click to expand...
That is indeed a ton of cash to save.
And spend on more hifi...

Here in oz the wiim is $500 and I see the Nad can be had for around $3800 (open box) rather than the usual $4500.
But still a significant price difference to the wiim.

imo blueos isn't significantly better than the wiim app either, and if you use one of the 'connect' things, or bubble upnp, instead it's immaterial.

Enjoy!

Edit: Or LMS, to keep that crowd happy ;) (in relation to blueos).
 
Last edited:
Thanks. Here in Germany the WiiMs RRP is 369€ and the NAD‘s 2.499€. It‘s also possible to buy the NAD used for around 1.800 EUR. Okay not ten times but still premium for the NAD and reasonable for the WiiM.

As others have said here on the forum: Mainstream HiFi indeed should be afraid…
 
DRC said:
How do you expect to hear a difference between the NAD and the Wiim if you only use Airplay 2? I bet you are using Spotify!
Click to expand...
:ROFLMAO:

However, even with Spotify when I changed amp in my main system (from the Marantz PM8005 to the Hegel H190 in my sig below) the difference was glaringly obvious, and that was about 3* price difference, full retail. Not wildly different in price bracket from the nad.
One might expect / hope that a brand with Nad's reputation and that costs that much more than the wiim would be significantly better.
But it does seem that that's not necessarily how hifi works!
 
I just wanted to point out that from my point of view it does not seem worth the money to purchase a high end premium amplifier for a few thousand bucks.

To be honest, after reading some reviews about the WiiM Amp I was unsure about whether the amp can really be that good for the money or if I should try a premium one. On a German HiFi forum they also said I should try the M10v2 for my Elacs as it is a very good amplifier. So I decided to test for myself and found that, again, from my point of view, a premium class amplifier does not seem to be worthy the premium money. I am glad that I did not purchase the NAD for MSRP but used instead.

Before my Elac BS 404.2 I started with the smaller BS 403.2 speakers. They sounded a little flat in my room so I made the switch to the larger 404.2. In contrast to the amplifier switch the difference to the old speakers was immediately noticeable.

I think it is just true that the role of amplifiers is overrated. Speaker, room and source are the parts that matter most.

By starting this thread I would like to share my experience so that others might not make the same mistake and believe that amplifiers that are much more expensive sound much better. That, from my point of view, seems to the case.

The NAD of course has better build quality, a great display - but that’s not worth 1-2T€ more I think.

Michael
 
Just my experience, about room correction...
I have a WiiM mini and a recently bought a NAD C3050LE. Before, I had a couple 1020a + 2150 still from Nad.
Trying to calibrate the response with internal PEQ, after REW and HouseCurve measures, did a very good job but it has limitations if there are physical impediments in positioning the subwoofer and speakers (example waf). The impossibility to act separately on stereo channels, it's also a limit. Anyway, as already said, very pleasant result.
When I switched to Dirac and did correct measurement and use the right target curve (maybe the instructions should give more importance to this), it was a really giant step further, absolutely stunning. Now everything sounds correct in space and in time.
My complains are instead to Bluos, having not Dlna, it's less versatile than WiiM and has some firmware quirks, known but still not addressed. It's service support, seems much less responsive than WiiM. This is the reason why I'm still using WiiM as alternative to Bluos.
I was considering to buy WiiM amp but after a Dirac demo and mainly for my "Boomerism", I got that 3050LE (luckily price wasn't a problem). Very very very satisfying...
 
Indeed. My Elac speakers are 3.200€ and Amp plus Streamer now only roughly 1/10 of that. And it sounds very good to me.

Glad I am allowing me an EQ now as well. There were times where I thought EQing is bad and I am prohibited to use it (as it alters the natural sound of the music). And since I was never satisfied with that „natural sound“ I kept on buying new equipment all the time!

Wondering if there is similar speaker performance with much cheaper ones than the Elacs as well…
 
Steve Woodhouse said:
Given the money, these two shouldn’t be in the same ballpark.

It’s astonishing where hi-fi has gone over the past few years.
Click to expand...
My suspicion (and I'm always willing to be proven wrong) is that there is no reason why audio electronics should cost exorbitant amounts. A good design can be replicated at infinitum, there's nothing in it that has to be particularly expensive., or handmade, or use angels' tears.

Some genuinely, fervently believe that a €100 DAC can't possibly sound anywhere near as good as a €1000 one, but I'm highly sceptical of the idea that it can. I'm certainly sceptical of the idea that it can meaningfully increase the joy I get from my music, which ought to be the object of any upgrade.

I love the WiiM amp (and what the
WiiM platform brings to the party in general) because it's making clearer and clearer to a lot of people that, especially before you reach the transducers, there's little or no reason to p**s money up the wall.
 
cooky560 said:
Hifi is subjective. If you find something that sounds good to you, ignore others telling you their million dollar gear sounds better, or you’ll be chasing a sound you already have forever.

Enjoy the wiim for many years to come
Click to expand...

Yes, but I think we can test objectively.

Indeed, I know we can.

 
i agree with a lot of what has been said in this thread. the value of products in Hi-Fi has recently been getting better and better. in fact, i find it hard to actually come up with an area of consumer tech that has actually materially improved to the same degree in the past decade than high end audio. 🤯

but i also want to remind people when they make statements about expensive equipment from high end legacy manufacturers that there is a reason why many of them continue to exist and thrive despite the new brands that are starting to enter and even dominate parts of the high end market... 🤔

there are no subsidies in pro audio, and there is nobody "forcing" anyone to buy anything - it's all voluntary, and essentially for fun - so there is no "captive" demand for these products protecting the manufacturers. also, contrary to what many believe - i reckon as a whole in general we are pretty rational consumers. (not as gullible and suiggestible as many would say) therefore - if you see a company that has built a reputation in this space it's usually because they earned it somehow...

that's not to say that some of them haven't gotten complacent recently - charging a premium just for their brand recognition. but that is a separate issue and in fairness - paying extra for a brand with a history of executing over a long period of time is also maybe not as silly as it sounds on face value 🤷‍♂️ and that's what competition is supposed to help stamp out anyways
 
hashkey said:
My suspicion (and I'm always willing to be proven wrong) is that there is no reason why audio electronics should cost exorbitant amounts. A good design can be replicated at infinitum, there's nothing in it that has to be particularly expensive., or handmade, or use angels' tears.

Some genuinely, fervently believe that a €100 DAC can't possibly sound anywhere near as good as a €1000 one, but I'm highly sceptical of the idea that it can. I'm certainly sceptical of the idea that it can meaningfully increase the joy I get from my music, which ought to be the object of any upgrade.

I love the WiiM amp (and what the
WiiM platform brings to the party in general) because it's making clearer and clearer to a lot of people that, especially before you reach the transducers, there's little or no reason to p**s money up the wall.
Click to expand...
well, if you listen to the manufacturers describing their products - and you kind of agree with them, then there are objective reasons for why it costs a lot of money to get to a certain level of performance. whether that is worth it for you is another question entirely. but no doubt, the cost barriers to entry into high end audio are coming down still.
 
bowsandarrows said:
i agree with a lot of what has been said in this thread. the value of products in Hi-Fi has recently been getting better and better. in fact, i find it hard to actually come up with an area of consumer tech that has actually materially improved to the same degree in the past decade than high end audio. 🤯

but i also want to remind people when they make statements about expensive equipment from high end legacy manufacturers that there is a reason why many of them continue to exist and thrive despite the new brands that are starting to enter and even dominate parts of the high end market... 🤔

there are no subsidies in pro audio, and there is nobody "forcing" anyone to buy anything - it's all voluntary, and essentially for fun - so there is no "captive" demand for these products protecting the manufacturers. also, contrary to what many believe - i reckon as a whole in general we are pretty rational consumers. (not as gullible and suiggestible as many would say) therefore - if you see a company that has built a reputation in this space it's usually because they earned it somehow...

that's not to say that some of them haven't gotten complacent recently - charging a premium just for their brand recognition. but that is a separate issue and in fairness - paying extra for a brand with a history of executing over a long period of time is also maybe not as silly as it sounds on face value 🤷‍♂️ and that's what competition is supposed to help stamp out anyways
Click to expand...

Surely, the high end now only exists for prestige, and pride of ownership.

Okay, turntables may be different, and speakers certainly are, but pretty much everything in between there’s little need to spend a fortune.

Even with speakers, I feel the gap is closing. You can buy very, very good, flat response, low distortion speakers for £250, though you’ll need to add a sub.

I’m comfortable with the fact that I’m probably never going to be able to afford a speaker with a beryllium speaker. I’m comfortable that, if I could, it’s sound better than one without. I’m comfortable that the difference would (to my ears) would be small. In short, if I win the lottery, great. If I don’t, I’m happy that I’m not missing out on a great deal.
 
cooky560 said:
We can. But if you like the output, you don’t need to
Click to expand...

Absolutely. Sorry, to clarify. You can now use that fairly cheap device to swap between two amps to see if you can tell a difference. And if the two amps (unlike a valve amp) have a flat frequency response, and fairly low noise and distortion, you won’t be able to.
 
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