WiiM Ultra launch price

At what price would the WiiM Ultra be a compelling choice without sacrificing value?

  • US $349, EUR 379, GBP 349

  • US $399, EUR 429, GBP 399

  • US $449, EUR 449, GBP 449

  • Other - please specify price with currency in the comments


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I thought that too. But when I tried my Pro plus directly into my Apollon NCx500 instead of via the (balanced) Topping D70 Pro DAC, I honestly couldn't hear any noise, nor really any significant difference in sound. Neither could my partner (maybe a *hint* of something made her actually slightly prefer without the DAC, could just be different filters between the two)
The best way I can describe it, especially in instrumental and classical music, with balanced during quiet parts, the quiet is more void. When the instruments start again, it's more lively coming out of that dark quiet.

Calling it noise using RCA is an exaggeration for me, but if I had the choice I'll take balanced every time.
 
I don't think I've had issues with humming, even when using amps from 50 years ago, on an electrical circuit from nearly 60 years ago...

Perhaps I've been lucky
Perhaps we have been lucky. I have a preamp and a power amp with about 5m of unbalanced cable in between and no noise
 
Some amps perform better from balanced inputs.
Yes, most do including mine ... on paper :) I think in both case the SINAD is above 100dB though, I might take louder volume and younger ears than line to differentiate.

That said I'm in the 'I want the best' crowd myself and thus would have preferred balanced output as well. But it won't be a deal breaker, at least for me.
 
Unless you are dealing with hum problems.
Have you had humming problems? Recording studios have hundreds and hundreds of feet of wire running over power, cables, ethernet cables, AC line, cables, etc.They also convert back from single ended back to XLR. Balanced in the home if said equipment is truly balanced/redundant is completely unnecessary and at 399 it’s not going to be truly symmetrical. It may have an XLR connector, but that doesn’t mean it’s balanced and then it’ll probably have a cheap op amp to boost the voltage. In many entices, it probably won’t sound as good as single ended
 
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The best way I can describe it, especially in instrumental and classical music, with balanced during quiet parts, the quiet is more void. When the instruments start again, it's more lively coming out of that dark quiet.

Calling it noise using RCA is an exaggeration for me, but if I had the choice I'll take balanced every time.
What equipment are you using that’s fully symmetrical. So you’ve tried your equipment which we don’t know what it is and it’s sounds better and quieter on balance than single-ended. And you know it’s fully balanced and they’re not just taking the single ended and converting it to XLR at the output and giving you two XLR connections, not trying to be rude, not trying to bash your equipment, but I highly doubt that.
 
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I'm not worried, but I know the difference first hand. A DAC/pre-amp playing a high quality song going out to a fully balanced amp has an audible (less audible?) noise floor. It's absolutely easy to discern.

It's worse the longer your cable runs are, but even with short runs close to power cables and equipment with integrated power supplies, it's noticable.

I didn't believe it myself until saw/heard it demonstrated. It's not mind blowing, but it's the difference between a good stereo, and an audiophile quality sound stage.
Again, I find this hard to believe. Can you show us some numbers and what dac and preamp are you talking about? i’ve got my VPI turntable in the back of my room running 30 feet of cable single ended without a problem if anything is going to pick up noise it’s going to be a turntable.
 
While there are probably some benefits to XLR that are measurable (if not audible). I stand by it being pointless for homes systems.

Darko audio talks about the i2s standard, this is also something that we simply don't need in the home space.

Has anyone ever had a story where XLR has made a marked improvement to their audio quality, outside of a recording studio?
 
Quite a lot of 2 channel audio systems employ monoblock power amps that typically provide XLR inputs, which are optimal for noise rejection and signal gain. If the Ultra is trying to be a sort of be-all, end-all streaming preamp, WiiM will want to appeal to that pretty important consumer segment.
My point is that even equipment is fully balanced like balanced audio technologyBAT is not necessary, does it sell more equipment probably yes it also takes more parts/ money to do it right. And if you’re basing the sales of this streamer being truly balanced, I would have to disagree. Its not going to make it sound better as a matter fact, some designers don’t believe in making balance equipment. My convergent audio technology preamp is fully single ended. And so are the monoblock that Ken Stevens makes are single ended. The SL one was considered by many then and now to be the best tube preamp available, especially the phono stage. I could not afford his equipment now when I bought mine 25 years ago, it was just a measly 8k for the preamp with outboard power. I also had the advantage of working at Audio store and getting it at an incredible price.https://www.catamps.com/
 
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this is indeed a precaution to take during these comparisons..but overall the dacs of this type offer each other quite similar options...you can with "plus" *
make your teenagers-20en work..see your teenagers-20en so well trained in the classical music on acoustic instruments that they know well
;-)

*if the option is not offered on certain dacs, or even many old dacs, it is quite easy to observe the option taken..
this is an important subject which has always been underlying concerning DACs, which has become obvious to everyone with the arrival of very general public DACs offering these choices...
My point is that even equipment is fully balanced like balanced audio technology BAT is not necessary, does it sell more equipment probably yes it also takes more parts/money to do it right. And if you’re basing the sales of this streamer being truly balanced, I would have to disagree. It’s not going to make it sound better as a matter fact, some designers don’t believe in making balance equipment. My convergent audio technology SL-1 preamp is fully single ended. And so are the monoblock that Ken Stevens makes are single ended. The SL-1 is considered by many then and now to be the best tube preamp/ even against ss balanced preamps that are available. The CAT SL-1 phono preamp is considered to be one of the finest in the world is single ended. I could not afford his equipment now when I bought mine 25 years ago, it was just a measly 8k for the preamp with outboard power supply total weight of the preamp is 75 lbs. I also had the advantage of working at Audio store and getting it at an incredible price.https://trackingangle.com/features/convergent-audio-technology-axpona-2023
this is indeed a precaution to take during these comparisons..but overall the dacs of this type offer each other quite similar options...you can with "plus" *
make your teenagers-20en work..see your teenagers-20en so well trained in the classical music on acoustic instruments that they know well
;-)

*if the option is not offered on certain dacs, or even many old dacs, it is quite easy to observe the option taken..
this is an important subject which has always been underlying concerning DACs, which has become obvious to everyone with the arrival of very general public DACs offering these choices...
Again, are these dac’s truly symmetrical at their price points, you can have an XLR output and not be a redundant circuit. Can you show us said dac’s
 
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I'm not worried, but I know the difference first hand. A DAC/pre-amp playing a high quality song going out to a fully balanced amp has an audible (less audible?) noise floor. It's absolutely easy to discern.

It's worse the longer your cable runs are, but even with short runs close to power cables and equipment with integrated power supplies, it's noticable.

I didn't believe it myself until saw/heard it demonstrated. It's not mind blowing, but it's the difference between a good stereo, and an audiophile quality sound stage.
I would have to whole hardly disagree with that! Absolutely not true. So you just basically said you can’t have a high-end stereo if it’s not balanced. And what does being balanced have anything to do with soundstage😆
 
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https://trackingangle.com/features/convergent-audio-technology-axpona-2023 What equipment are you using that’s fully symmetrical. So you’ve tried your equipment which we don’t know what it is and it’s sounds better and quieter on balance than single-ended. And you know it’s fully balanced and they’re not just taking the single ended and converting it to XLR at the output and giving you two XLR connections, not trying to be rude, not trying to bash your equipment, but I highly doubt that.
 
Again, I find this hard to believe. Can you show us some numbers and what dac and preamp are you talking about? i’ve got my VPI turntable in the back of my room running 30 feet of cable single ended without a problem if anything is going to pick up noise it’s going to be a turntable.
So this would not be considered high-end to you. It’s only single ended so I guess not https://www.catamps.com/
 
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We don't need to argue about xlr's.
The images show that it doesn't have them.
People who want XLR will buy something different, and those who don't need xlr's can't convince them.
 
We don't need to argue about xlr's.
The images show that it doesn't have them.
People who want XLR will buy something different, and those who don't need xlr's can't convince them.
I agree it’s pointless. To much coffee and scotch this evening 😆
 
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