HDMI ARC hijacking inputs

[hgo58]

The WiiM Ultra update v5.2.730566 do still not fix this HDMI CEC issue.

@WiiM Support: When can we expect it to be fixed, so I can use the HDMI ARC input again as I could when the WiiM was bought?

 

[audiobliss]

Don't you think that if they could, they would have done it already. They are constantly fixing all sorts of bugs that we were not even aware was a problem.

 

[slartibartfast]

Don't you think that if they could, they would have done it already. They are constantly fixing all sorts of bugs that we were not even aware was a problem.

I believe one of the beta firmwares did fix it but for whatever reason they didn't use that fix.

 

[hgo58]

Don't you think that if they could, they would have done it already. They are constantly fixing all sorts of bugs that we were not even aware was a problem.

I have been told that a new Beta Testing is coming.

The reason, I have been told, for not fixing it, is that a fix will conflict with some request from other users to always have the TV to use the ARC out. I do however think that is a misunderstanding!

Let us hope the upcoming fix will handle both use cases.

 

[Wiimer]

I have been told that a new Beta Testing is coming.

The reason, I have been told, for not fixing it, is that a fix will conflict with some request from other users to always have the TV to use the ARC out. I do however think that is a misunderstanding!

Let us hope the upcoming fix will handle both use cases.

'Always have the TV to use the ARC out' the team said?

I didn't understand what they meant..

I remember that at least my request was that audio must always be output from the WiiM speakers when WiiM CEC is on; there was no mention of what happens when CEC is off.

But as I said before, everything is working as expected on my TV. I don't need to change anything and don't want to see this break again.

If it breaks again, I plan to protest vigorously again

 

[hgo58]

'Always have the TV to use the ARC out' the team said?

I didn't understand what they meant..

As it is now the TV always switch to ARC when turned on, even when the WiiM stay in standby.

I remember that at least my request was that audio must always be output from the WiiM speakers when WiiM CEC is on; there was no mention of what happens when CEC is off.

Exactly. That is the misunderstanding by the @WiiM Team. They have implemented it for all cases, so that users like me that only want sound via WiiM in some cases cannot avoid the ARC TV out, except if removing the HDMI cable.

But as I said before, everything is working as expected on my TV. I don't need to change anything and don't want to see this break again.

And that is why WiiM have not fixed it for others. They are afraid of you

 

[Wiimer]

As it is now the TV always switch to ARC when turned on, even when the WiiM stay in standby.

Exactly. That is the misunderstanding by the @WiiM Team. They have implemented it for all cases, so that users like me that only want sound via WiiM in some cases cannot avoid the ARC TV out, except if removing the HDMI cable.

And that is why WiiM have not fixed it for others. They are afraid of you

If the team has any work to do, all they need to do is find out why some TVs have issues when WiiM's CEC is off, and fix it.

They should buy the same model of TV as yours and connect it to the Ultra to see how the TV and Ultra behave when the Ultra's CEC is off.

You can also send your Sony to California.

 

[hgo58]

If the team has any work to do, all they need to do is find out why some TVs have issues when WiiM's CEC is off, and fix it.

They should buy the same model of TV as yours and connect it to the Ultra to see how the TV and Ultra behave when the Ultra's CEC is off.

You can also send your Sony to California.

I don't think there is any need to test specifically on a Sony TV. It's clear what is happening. The WiiM Ultra has the CEC discovery turned on and the TV "see" that and changes to ARC out. On the WiiM the HDMI settings are however turned off, so the WiiM do not leave standby or switch input to HDMI.

The simple fix, with HDMI settings off, is to only turn on CEC discovery when HDMI input is (manually) selected.

With HDMI settings on, it shall work as it does now.

I have tried to tell the @WiiM Team this for a long time now. The thing is, that this was working when I got the WiiM Ultra but broke with an update in January. A Beta Testing version I tested in February fixed the issue but was never implemented in the main version.

I really hope WiiM gets it right this time.

 

[Wiimer]

I don't think there is any need to test specifically on a Sony TV. It's clear what is happening. The WiiM Ultra has the CEC discovery turned on and the TV "see" that and changes to ARC out. On the WiiM the HDMI settings are however turned off, so the WiiM do not leave standby or switch input to HDMI.

The simple fix, with HDMI settings off, is to only turn on CEC discovery when HDMI input is (manually) selected.

With HDMI settings on, it shall work as it does now.

However, as my previously tested in another thread, I can't reproduce your problem on my TV

 

[hgo58]

However, as my previously tested in another thread, I can't reproduce your problem on my TV

So with TV on internal speakers when you turn it on, it do not switch to ARC out? I would say that is a bug in the TVs implementation of the CEC unless there is some configuration for this.

Unfortunately I cannot configure the Sony TV to ignore the CEC discovery in this case. I can turn CEC off but then my other attached devices will not work and the same with volume control when using the WiiM.

 

[hgo58]

However, as my previously tested in another thread, I can't reproduce your problem on my TV

You can test the issue as follows:

1)
Let the TV play through the WiiM.

2)
Disconnect the HDMI cable.
This shall cause the TV to switch to internal speakers.

3)
Disabled all HDMI settings in the WiiM, select a non-hdmi input and let it go into standby.

4)
Reconnect the HDMI cable.
What happens here?
The TV should stay on internal speakers until you manually selected the HDMI input on the WiiM.
On my Sony TV it do however switch back to ARC but nothing happens on the Ultra.

 

[Wiimer]

You can test the issue as follows:

1)
Let the TV play through the WiiM.

2)
Disconnect the HDMI cable.
This shall cause the TV to switch to internal speakers.

No. Unplugging the HDMI cable does not switch to the TV speakers. I will not hear anything. This is because ARC is selected in my TV's audio output settings. If I manually switch the audio output to TV speakers, I will hear sound from the TV.

3)
Disabled all HDMI settings in the WiiM, select a non-hdmi input and let it go into standby.

4)
Reconnect the HDMI cable.
What happens here?
The TV should stay on internal speakers until you manually selected the HDMI input on the WiiM.
On my Sony TV it do however switch back to ARC but nothing happens on the Ultra.

 

[Wiimer]

.

4)
Reconnect the HDMI cable.
What happens here?
The TV should stay on internal speakers until you manually selected the HDMI input on the WiiM.
On my Sony TV it do however switch back to ARC but nothing happens on the Ultra.

Nothing happens.

The TV is silent and the WiiM remains on standby; even when the WiiM is turned on standby, it does not switch to the HDMI input. (This is a natural consequence as all the HDMI toggles on the WiiM are off.)

 

[hgo58]

Nothing happens.

The TV is silent and the WiiM remains on standby; even when the WiiM is turned on standby, it does not switch to the HDMI input. (This is a natural consequence as all the HDMI toggles on the WiiM are off.)

Yes. I see that also but that is not what should happen. The TV should change to internal speakers as I don't have it set to fixed ARC out.

Your use case is different from mine, so you don't see the issue.

No. Unplugging the HDMI cable does not switch to the TV speakers. I will not hear anything. This is because ARC is selected in my TV's audio output settings. If I manually switch the audio output to TV speakers, I will hear sound from the TV.

Again, you have fixed ARC and don't use the internal speakers. So the TV don't care about the CEC discovery.

 

[Burnside]

Surely the TV should switch to its internal speakers even when it has tv arc enabled if it can’t detect an active external device to output the audio to? If I have a WiiM device connected that doesn’t have HDMI sensing enabled and it’s on another input, then to the tv surely that should equate to non-detection of an active external device and cause it to use its internal speakers?

 

[Wiimer]

The situation changes when I switch the audio output on my TV to 'Auto'.



When the HDMI cable is unplugged, the audio output switches to the TV speakers; turn off all HDMI toggles on the WiiM, then put the WiiM in standby off.

When the HDIMI cable is connected, the TV output switches to ARC and no sound is emitted from the TV speakers. And the WiiM remains in standby mode.

Is this the behaviour you want?

 

[hgo58]

Surely the TV should switch to its internal speakers even when it has tv arc enabled if it can’t detect an active external device to output the audio to? If I have a WiiM device connected that doesn’t have HDMI sensing enabled and it’s on another input, then to the tv surely that should equate to non-detection of an active external device and cause it to use its internal speakers?

And that was how it worked initially, until someone complained about it. The misunderstanding by the@WiiM Team is however that they implemented the CEC always on also in case where all HDMI settings in the WiiM is off.

 

[hgo58]

The situation changes when I switch the audio output on my TV to 'Auto'.



When the HDMI cable is unplugged, the audio output switches to the TV speakers; turn off all HDMI toggles on the WiiM, then put the WiiM in standby off.

When the HDIMI cable is connected, the TV output switches to ARC and no sound is emitted from the TV speakers. And the WiiM remains in standby mode.

Is this the behaviour you want?

No, that is exactly the wrong behaviour that we are complaining about.

The TV should not change to ARC, as the WiiM is not receiving it.

So I can now see your TV behaves in the same way as my Sony. The TV CEC is correctly implemented, it's the WiiM implementation that is wrong.

I really hope that the @WiiM Team understand it this time. It has been a struggle to make them (and others) to understand.

 

[Wiimer]

No, that is exactly the wrong behaviour that we are complaining about.

The TV should not change to ARC, as the WiiM is not receiving it.

So I can now see your TV behaves in the same way as my Sony. The TV CEC is correctly implemented, it's the WiiM implementation that is wrong.

I really hope that the @WiiM Team understand it this time. It has been a struggle to make them (and others) to understand.

To be honest, I'm not sure if this is normal or abnormal. It is possible that it works the same way on my AVR. (Untested..)

I think using a smart plug and turning it on only when using the WiiM may solve the problem ?

 

[hgo58]

To be honest, I'm not sure if this is normal or abnormal. It is possible that it works the same way on my AVR. (Untested..)

I think using a smart plug and turning it on only when using the WiiM may solve the problem ?

Or WiiM could just fix it
It's easy to do and they have done it before. They just got confused.