Line In/Coax Out with the same device

[optimusComposite]

I just got a new Pro Plus and pairing it with my AS501 amp. I currently have a bunch of things connected to the AMP (TTs, CD, DJ mixer and optical from TV).

The amp is connected to my only set of passive speakers via RCA. I am looking to pass the coax out from the wiim to the coax in of the amp while also passing an RCA out from the amp to the Line in of the wiim. Reasoning that I can pass my streaming output to the amp and therefore main speakers, and I can pass any of the above amp select inputs to the wiim and broadcast to external mini echos(via multiroom? I'm still figuring this out).

Is there a problem with this setup? Any sort of feedback/loop problems I'll encounter? of course inputs and outputs can work simutaneously but to the same device? The Wiim is currently fixed and prefer to control all volume(and signals) from the amp. Feel free to call me dumb but I'm trying to wrap my head around if this setup makes sense.

 

[harkpabst]

The amp is connected to my only set of passive speakers via RCA.

Passive speakers connected via RCA? Are you sure about that?

I am looking to pass the coax out from the wiim to the coax in of the amp while also passing an RCA out from the amp to the Line in of the wiim. Reasoning that I can pass my streaming output to the amp and therefore main speakers, and I can pass any of the above amp select inputs to the wiim and broadcast to external mini echos(via multiroom? I'm still figuring this out).

This is generally doable. You just need to use an RCA output of the amp that provides the necessary signal. If you want to be able to play music in the other room only, the speakers off switch will do.

Line 2 and Line 3 both have a REC output. Since there is no separate record selector I assume that both output the signal of the currently selected source. The REC output is at a fixed volume, so you will have to control the volume in the other room from the Mini's volume slider in the WiiM Home App.

There's no danger of unwanted feedback, don't worry. This setup makes only sense when streaming the sources connected to the amp directly, of course. That's not a limitation, because grouping the WiiM Pro Plus and the WiiM Mini allows to distribute any streaming music anyway.

 

[Mr Ee]

Is there a problem with this setup?

Welcome.

One springs to mind.
If the AS501 amp is the "source" (as far as the pro plus is concerned) of a signal then it will send the sound to the speakers and to the pro plus at the same time.
The pro plus being in multiroom will add a delay to the signal, i.e. the other rooms / speakers won't be in sync with the main speakers attached to the AS501.

 

[optimusComposite]

Passive speakers connected via RCA? Are you sure about that?

Whoops lol. Just to speaker terminals. Too many connections to think about.

This is generally doable. You just need to use an RCA output of the amp that provides the necessary signal. If you want to be able to play music in the other room only, the speakers off switch will do.

Yup this is what I figured. Some independence.

Line 2 and Line 3 both have a REC output. Since there is no separate record selector I assume that both output the signal of the currently selected source. The REC output is at a fixed volume, so you will have to control the volume in the other room from the Mini's volume slider in the WiiM Home App.

Makes sense. I don't mind that.

There's no danger of unwanted feedback, don't worry. This setup makes only sense when streaming the sources connected to the amp directly, of course. That's not a limitation, because grouping the WiiM Pro Plus and the WiiM Mini allows to distribute any streaming music anyway.

Ah thanks

 

[optimusComposite]

If the AS501 amp is the "source" (as far as the pro plus is concerned) of a signal then it will send the sound to the speakers and to the pro plus at the same time.
The pro plus being in multiroom will add a delay to the signal, i.e. the other rooms / speakers won't be in sync with the main speakers attached to the AS501.

This is a good point. How much delay do you presume? I feel that the rooms are of considerable separation, they don't mesh enough to cause noticeable delay

 

[Mr Ee]

This is a good point. How much delay do you presume? I feel that the rooms are of considerable separation, they don't mesh enough to cause noticeable delay

Can you choose the Group Audio Delay value for Line In in the Audio Input screen?
I can for line in on my Ultras, but not my Pro (not a pro plus).

Edit - strange, only 1 of my 3 Pros allows me to choose a delay for Line In, for the other two it's not available as an option.
None of them have anything plugged into their line ins.

 

[Wiimer]

Edit - strange, only 1 of my 3 Pros allows me to choose a delay for Line In, for the other two it's not available as an option.
None of them have anything plugged into their line ins.

Have you hidden the Line-in? The group delay for hidden inputs is not displayed.

 

[Mr Ee]

Have you hidden the Line-in? The group delay for hidden inputs is not displayed.

Maybe!
I certainly have no intention of using it

Edit: that was it, Line In was hidden on 2 of them.

 

[optimusComposite]

Can choose the Group Audio Delay value for Line In in the Audio Input screen?
I can for line in on my Ultras, but not my Pro (not a pro plus).

Yeah I have the option. Currently set high. I'm getting new cables, so i'll test this all when it arrives. Thanks for you help

 

[hipoagumol]

Just saying... why not the other way around? Use wiim pro plus as the media hub for all inputs and you'll benefit of centralized volume control , superior DAC, room correction for all sources plus the casting option to your minis.
I also own an as501 and used to have tuner (rca), cd player(optical), tv input(optical) connected to my Wiim Pro Plus (whose analogue output went to the amplifier). The CD and TV where multiplexed via an optical switch with remote (15 euros at aliexpress) so i had 2 opticals and 1 analogue (tuner), plus rj45 ethernet connected to the pro plus. I assume you can do something similar with your multiple sources. Lately I upgraded with a Wiim Ultra and use same inputs but now TV connected via HDMI, so optical switch no longer needed.

Regards

 

[optimusComposite]

Just saying... why not the other way around? Use wiim pro plus as the media hub for all inputs and you'll benefit of centralized volume control , superior DAC, room correction for all sources plus the casting option to your minis.
I also own an as501 and used to have tuner (rca), cd player(optical), tv input(optical) connected to my Wiim Pro Plus (whose analogue output went to the amplifier). The CD and TV where multiplexed via an optical switch with remote (15 euros at aliexpress) so i had 2 opticals and 1 analogue (tuner), plus rj45 ethernet connected to the pro plus. I assume you can do something similar with your multiple sources. Lately I upgraded with a Wiim Ultra and use same inputs but now TV connected via HDMI, so optical switch no longer needed.

Regards

Yeah, this isn't a bad idea. I was more hellbent on the original thought since I had setup most of the connections to the amp and didn't want to get any more devices added(Too many wires :-/ ). I'll think about this too. How much better did you like the DAC on the WiiM compared to the 501? And its analougue(Line) out to the amp and I assume this bypasses the DAC in the amp correct? If I did coax out, it'll be the oppposite?

 

[hipoagumol]

DAC in pro plus is better on specs than yamaha's. That does not mean anyone would feel the difference. The point here is using wiim pro plus the way it was thought to: as a streamer-preamp device. I simply think your approach: sources->yamaha>wiim>yamaha is unnecesarely cumbersome...
Your idea of using one of your amp inputs redirected via rca output to Wiim where it can be casted over other devices...It means you need your amp and main room speakers to be connected for that purpose...so you have no choice but playing in minimum 2 rooms always...
The approach I suggest you have full control if you want play casting any of your sources to your main speakers only, or to your main plus 1, 2...other room(s) systems.. or skip completely your main system, muting pro plus sound while grouped with another devices so your can keep the yamaha just off/stand by.

HiFi typical chain is: sources->preamp->amp-speakers. Wiim pro plus is a preamp which can handle analogue and digital sources and it is a digital source itself (streaming). Your yamaha a-s501 would be just used as a power amplifier..one single rca input (the rca out of wiim) amplified for your main room speakers.
You'd be centralizing all sources into the wiim pro plus where your will have much more control opportunities of all your source signals processed in the digital domain by a modern top rated DSP and DAC, all from your hand with the amazing Wiim Home App: pre-gain, per source volume control (i just set my yamaha's volume knob to a fixed position and control volume with wiim), room correction , powerful EQ and parametric EQ , plus you could cast ALL your sources to the Minis in other rooms as you wish.

Only problematic source would be if you have a turntable without in-built phono preamp, for which you would need an external phono stage as wiim pro plus lacks phono input...Or leave it connected to the yamaha's phono in and use a rec out to feed the analogue rca input of wiim, so you can also pass the vinyl sound through wiim (benefit of room correction, EQ etc) and even cast vinyls to other rooms.
But you may also consider using an external phono preamp in the middle of the turntable and connect its rca output to wiim pro plus rca input directly...
But what i think is even better than al the above is getting an Ultra instead ,which has phono and hdmi inputs.
With an Ultra, the turntable would go via Phono, tv via hdmi, cd via optical. All straight into their dedicated inputs. The dj mixer no sure what is, if it outputs analogue rca you'd still have spare the analogue rca input on wiim ultra and you'd be done, no more boxes. If that dj mixer outputs digital you can multiplex it with the CD on optical input using some external box/converter as the one I showed in my previous post. Same if you had or want to add later other digital or analogue sources: there are cheap switches with remote control that you can install to alternate among them to feed the wiim pro+/ultra rca/optical/hdmi.

Hope this clarifies my point, sorry for long post guys.

 

[optimusComposite]

Mate, this is so useful. Thanks so much for the breakdown. Yeah, I understand you, makes sense. I have to think up all my usage case scenarios.

I woud get the ultra based off this but honestly the pro plus seems to fulfil most of the wants(and I got it at a deal). Ah, I should mention, I have two TTs (Technics Mk2s) and the mixer is an A&H xone 43c. It has analogue outputs and a phono pre-amp, so I actually have been using it for my phono stage (since the TTs aren't built in) and it seems to work well. So I can pass it as line to any multiplixers. I think that ties things together well.

 

[hipoagumol]

Ok, since the dj mixer has phono preamps and outputs any of the TTs or even mixed TTs sounds through an RCA line output then that is your phono stage plus multiplexer for the turntables, don't need anything external.

So I think you can just choose pro plus or ultra and only difference is how you plug in TV and CD player, through external Optical multiplexer or directly

a) This would be the scheme with a Wiim pro plus, if your CD player has optical output you 'd need the kind of device i linked you in my first post ( or this one )

TT1+TT2->phono 1+phono 2 Inputs of DJ mixer--> Analog Rca Out-->Wiim Pro+ RCA Input

CD-->Optical Out--> SPDIF multiplexer Input 1

TV-->Optical--> SPDIF multiplexer input 2

SPDIF multiplexer Output--> Wiim Pro+ Optical Input

Wiim Pro+ RCA output--> Yamaha A-S501 RCA Input

b) This would be the scheme with a Wiim Ultra, don't need anything extra:

TT1+TT2->phono 1+phono 2 Inputs of DJ mixer--> Analog Rca Out-->Wiim Ultra RCA Input

CD-->Optical Out--> Wiim Ultra Optical Input

TV-->HDMI ARC--> Wiim Ultra HDMI Input

Wiim Ultra RCA output--> Yamaha A-S501 RCA Input

Cool

Regards

 

[optimusComposite]

Haha Nice. This was my thoughts after your explanation. Cheers