Pair or not to Pair ?

[Lomax_hjs]

I understand, It's probally just my silly brain

What I think is with setting a crossover point you limit the speaker and the sub a bit. (it's now set at 45 Hz)

So below 45Hz the speakers can still ad something in the mix and above the Sub can do that, if you unpair the speakers and don't have to set a crossover.

 

[harkpabst]

What I think is with setting a crossover point you limit the speaker and the sub a bit. (it's now set at 45 Hz)

So below 45Hz the speakers can still ad something in the mix and above the Sub can do that, if you unpair the speakers and don't have to set a crossover.

Well, yes. But this is exactly what is desired for good integration of main speakers and subwoofer: You want to keep the overlapping range small. Relieving the main speakers from deep sub-bass reduces distortion and also reduces the amount of amplifier power needed for the main speakers (again, reducing distortion and enabling higher SPL).

If the subwoofer is not positioned close to the speakers, a clean crossover between mains and sub is even more important.

RoomFit will do a decent job in cutting any excess boom. But there are extra benefits to starting with a clean configuration.

 

[Ajaxlegend]

I have the same issue where there's no bass when I have the Sub Pro paired with the Amp Ultra. Even Roomfit shows this in the measurement (it comes back at 90hz measurements as the lowest instead of 30hz). When I unpair it everything is fine and there is bass. But I bought it especially for the pairing mode. Is this a software or hardware issue? I'm a bit lost as I've tried everything and e-mail support with Wiim just added to the confusion as I don't think they understand what I'm talking about. Which is probably on me as I'm having trouble articulating the issue well.

 

[harkpabst]

I have the same issue where there's no bass when I have the Sub Pro paired with the Amp Ultra. Even Roomfit shows this in the measurement (it comes back at 90hz measurements as the lowest instead of 30hz). When I unpair it everything is fine and there is bass. But I bought it especially for the pairing mode. Is this a software or hardware issue? I'm a bit lost as I've tried everything and e-mail support with Wiim just added to the confusion as I don't think they understand what I'm talking about. Which is probably on me as I'm having trouble articulating the issue well.

So, are you using a wireless connection?

Which sources are you using? Are you aware of the current limitations in wireless mode, as documented here:

How to Set Up Your WiiM Sub Pro

TABLE OF CONTENTS Connection Mode What You'll Need Step-by-Step Setup Guide 1. Unbox the WiiM Sub Pro 2. Place the WiiM Sub Pro Properly 3. Power on the WiiM Sub Pro 4. Download the WiiM Home App 5. Set Up the WiiM Sub Pro through the Wi...

faq.wiimhome.com

Currently, When the WiiM Sub Pro is used in wireless mode, it may not produce bass during the following types of music playback:

• Alexa multi-room music
• Roon Ready
• LMS
• Google Cast

 

[Ajaxlegend]

So, are you using a wireless connection?

Which sources are you using? Are you aware of the current limitations in wireless mode, as documented here:

How to Set Up Your WiiM Sub Pro

TABLE OF CONTENTS Connection Mode What You'll Need Step-by-Step Setup Guide 1. Unbox the WiiM Sub Pro 2. Place the WiiM Sub Pro Properly 3. Power on the WiiM Sub Pro 4. Download the WiiM Home App 5. Set Up the WiiM Sub Pro through the Wi...

faq.wiimhome.com

No I'm using wired connection, cable to the subout of the Wiim Amp Ultra. Using Qobuz and tv via HDMI only. And for Roomfit measurements I use Dayton IMM6C with calibration file.

 

[harkpabst]

No I'm using wired connection, cable to the subout of the Wiim Amp Ultra. Using Qobuz and tv via HDMI only.

That's similar enough to how I use my WiiM Sub Pro and for sure I don't observe your issues.

Did you perform Subwoofer RoomFit and then RoomFit correction in this order?

 

[Ajaxlegend]

That's similar enough to how I use my WiiM Sub Pro and for sure I don't observe your issues.

Did you perform Subwoofer RoomFit and then RoomFit correction in this order?

Yes I do Roomfit for the subwoofer first. Everything looks very good there, just some drop off at 40hz which is to be expected for a 8 inch woofer. But then when I do Roomfit for the main speakers that's where I do something wrong or something goes wrong. Do I need to toggle some settings there? I have subwoofer calibration toggled on which I think is correct? And then for the frequency it doesn't matter if I put it at 60hz (which is the crossover I used in the Sub Pro Roomfit setting) or 30hz or 40hz. But maybe I should put it at the Sub Pro crossover setting at 60hz? I want to do Roomfit for 30-400hz.

 

[harkpabst]

Yes I do Roomfit for the subwoofer first. Everything looks very good there, just some drop off at 40hz which is to be expected for a 8 inch woofer. But then when I do Roomfit for the main speakers that's where I do something wrong or something goes wrong. Do I need to toggle some settings there? I have subwoofer calibration toggled on which I think is correct? And then for the frequency it doesn't matter if I put it at 60hz (which is the crossover I used in the Sub Pro Roomfit setting) or 30hz or 40hz. But maybe I should put it at the Sub Pro crossover setting at 60hz? I want to do Roomfit for 30-400hz.

If the WiiM Sub Pro is placed close to the front wall the lower frequency limit should be closer to 30 Hz than 40 Hz.

Honestly, I think that WiiM's documentation is still a bit lacking here. But if you have the WiiM Sub Pro linked with the WiiM Ultra, there's only one menu item for the subwoofer and mains configuration. Since Subwoofer Room Fit is expected to take care of the entire frequency range assigned to the Sub Pro, enabling subwoofer calibration shouldn't make a difference (because there's nothing to compensate for below the crossover frequency, since it's being dealt with by Subwoofer RoomFit).

I'm not sure about your speaker setup and your crossover frequency setting.

 

[Ajaxlegend]

If the WiiM Sub Pro is placed close to the front wall the lower frequency limit should be closer to 30 Hz than 40 Hz.

Honestly, I think that WiiM's documentation is still a bit lacking here. But if you have the WiiM Sub Pro linked with the WiiM Ultra, there's only one menu item for the subwoofer and mains configuration. Since Subwoofer Room Fit is expected to take care of the entire frequency range assigned to the Sub Pro, enabling subwoofer calibration shouldn't make a difference (because there's nothing to compensate for below the crossover frequency, since it's being dealt with by Subwoofer RoomFit).

I'm not sure about your speaker setup and your crossover frequency setting.

Yes that's what I figured so I left it at 30hz-400hz for the Roomfit. The subwoofer roomfit automatically does 30-110hz but crossover is set to 60hz as I run Proac D2 that are pretty decent in the bass department. Just the room will always have dips without a sub.

I will just set everything back to factory settings tomorrow and try again and see if that does it. Little stumped right now.

 

[Ajaxlegend]

@harkpabst quick question if you don't mind, when I have the Sub Pro paired with the Amp Ultra and I run the subwoofer roomfit first with a 60hz crossover do I change the "main" roomfit for the speakers to 60hz-400hz or do I still do the whole frequency which is 30-400hz in my case? And I'm guessing I should have subwoofer calibration turned on?

 

[harkpabst]

@harkpabst quick question if you don't mind, when I have the Sub Pro paired with the Amp Ultra and I run the subwoofer roomfit first with a 60hz crossover do I change the "main" roomfit for the speakers to 60hz-400hz or do I still do the whole frequency which is 30-400hz in my case? And I'm guessing I should have subwoofer calibration turned on?

Good questions and - admittedly - there is no official recommendation nor answer, so I have to stick with my own wisdom.

My personal choice was running the "main" RoomFit with subwoofer calibration enabled and setting the lower limit to the lower frequency response limit of the subwoofer. My reasoning: Since the subwoofer has already been optimised for the room, no filters should be needed (and consequently not wasted) on the range of the subwoofer, anyway.

Setting the lower limit to the crossover frequency exactly is not guaranteed to smooth out the crossover region, because real world filters are always overlapoing.

It worked out well in my particular use case.

 

[Ajaxlegend]

Good questions and - admittedly - there is no official recommendation nor answer, so I have to stick with my own wisdom.

My personal choice was running the "main" RoomFit with subwoofer calibration enabled and setting the lower limit to the lower frequency response limit of the subwoofer. My reasoning: Since the subwoofer has already been optimised for the room, no filters should be needed (and consequently not wasted) on the range of the subwoofer, anyway.

Setting the lower limit to the crossover frequency exactly is not guaranteed to smooth out the crossover region, because real world filters are always overlapoing.

It worked out well in my particular use case.

Thank you! So just to be sure as English isn't my first language, you would recommend setting the "main" frequency response to 60hz-400hz?

 

[harkpabst]

Thank you! So just to be sure as English isn't my first language, you would recommend setting the "main" frequency response to 60hz-400hz?

No, I would start with 30 Hz to 400 Hz, but expect find no more than maybe one filter (or none at all) in the range from 30 Hz to 60 Hz.

 

[Ajaxlegend]

No, I would start with 30 Hz to 400 Hz, but expect find no more than maybe one filter (or none at all) in the range from 30 Hz to 60 Hz.

Cheers and yes this is right the first point is at 80hz for me. Which is a little weird to not have the 60-80hz one.

Is it normal that when you see the graph for the "main" with what Roomfit will do that 30-70hz (in my case) looks like the subwoofer is not doing anything, but in the graph for just the subwoofer Roomfit the graph looks very good except for a small 45hz dip which is just my room?

 

[harkpabst]

Cheers and yes this is right the first point is at 80hz for me. Which is a little weird to not have the 60-80hz one.

If there's nothing that needs correction in this range (at least party due to Subwoofer RoomFit having taken care of it), then this is intended behaviour, indeed.

Is it normal that when you see the graph for the "main" with what Roomfit will do that 30-70hz (in my case) looks like the subwoofer is not doing anything, but in the graph for just the subwoofer Roomfit the graph looks very good except for a small 45hz dip which is just my room?

This OTOH doesn't look normal to me. The results page should show the measured frequency response alongside the target curve for the entire system, including the subwoofer.

Can you post a screenshot of the results page?

 

[Ajaxlegend]

If there's nothing that needs correction in this range (at least party due to Subwoofer RoomFit having taken care of it), then this is intended behaviour, indeed.


This OTOH doesn't look normal to me. The results page should show the measured frequency response alongside the target curve for the entire system, including the subwoofer.

Can you post a screenshot of the results page?

Here you go. As you can see it looks very different when I do the main roomfit.