Tech Tuesday: Deep Dive into Room Correction

[slartibartfast]

This almost looks as if the subwoofer setting is on, but no sub is connected.

The slope of the resulting effective acoustic high pass looks way too steep, even for a ported speaker. Between 20 Hz and 40 Hz it appears to be more than 40 dB per octave. This almost resembles the natural roll-off of a reflex box (24 dB/octave) plus an electrical 4th order high pass filter.

Edit:
This OTOH would not explain why there is rather too much perceived bass ...

Could it also be that subwoofer correction was turned off in room correction settings?

 

[Vignus]

When you measure with DSPeaker do you see the same roll off. I always associate DSPeaker with subwoofers. Do you have a subwoofer?

No I don't see or hear the same roll off and no, I don't have a subwoofer

 

[harkpabst]

The other obvious reason would be a microphone response that is not correctly compensated by the calibration file at all ...

Difficult to track down.

 

[Vignus]

Could it also be that subwoofer correction was turned off in room correction settings?

Since I don't have a subwoofer, yes the sub correction is off

 

[Vignus]

The other obvious reason would be a microphone response that is not correctly compensated by the calibration file at all ...

Difficult to track down.

Unlike, as I have tried with several mics: tablet internal, phone internal, USB uncalibrated external and lastly the Dayton USB C with calibrated file. The result in the bass region never really changed. Actually, the Dayton improved RC, but the bass region issue still persists.

 

[Wiimer]

Please check to see if the IMM-6C is working properly. Place the mic at close range of the Lumina's woofer and measure it to see if it picks up bass. Also in the case of Android phones, even if an external mic is connected, some models may not pick up bass sound sufficiently.

 

[slartibartfast]

Since I don't have a subwoofer, yes the sub correction is off

So is the subwoofer setting in the the WiiM Home app definitely disabled as well? It just looks like the signal to the speakers is high passed.

 

[Wiimer]

Unlike, as I have tried with several mics: tablet internal, phone internal, USB uncalibrated external and lastly the Dayton USB C with calibrated file. The result in the bass region never really changed. Actually, the Dayton improved RC, but the bass region issue still persists.

You see IMM-6C on the RC screen, right?

If the RC results for the built-in microphone and IMM-6C are the same, the microphone may not actually be recognized.

 

[Wiimer]

So is the subwoofer setting in the the WiiM Home app definitely disabled as well? It just looks like the signal to the speakers is high passed.

I thought so too, but in that case the bass should not be audible.
oddness

 

[Vignus]

So is the subwoofer setting in the the WiiM Home app definitely disabled as well? It just looks like the signal to the speakers is high passed.

Yes, it''s disabled

 

[Vignus]

You see IMM-6C on the RC screen, right?

If the RC results for the built-in microphone and IMM-6C are the same, the microphone may not actually be recognized.

Yes, I see iMM-6C on the screen, with the calibration file selected

 

[Vignus]

I thought so too, but in that case the bass should not be audible.
oddness

After having tried several other ways, and compared them to other RC systems I just came to the conclusion that Wiim RC isn't just mature enough yet. It's still in the early stage and I'm sure it will become good at one point, but not yet, in my experience.
Maybe I'm just too demanding, but for now I'll just use DSPeaker and check Wiim RC again when updates come through.
Nevertheless many of you have been very available to help, and I really appreciate that and thank everyone that's been contributing.

 

[slartibartfast]

After having tried several other ways, and compared them to other RC systems I just came to the conclusion that Wiim RC isn't just mature enough yet. It's still in the early stage and I'm sure it will become good at one point, but not yet, in my experience.
Maybe I'm just too demanding, but for now I'll just use DSPeaker and check Wiim RC again when updates come through.
Nevertheless many of you have been very available to help, and I really appreciate that and thank everyone that's been contributing.

The WiiM immature RC isn't causing your speakers to roll off well above 50Hz though. That is still a mystery.

 

[canard]

The WiiM immature RC isn't causing your speakers to roll off well above 50Hz though. That is still a mystery.

bass reflex...24db cut... ( clos 12db)

 

[harkpabst]

bass reflex...24db cut... ( clos 12db)

No, not close at all. The slope is closer to 48 dB and it's a ported speaker.

 

[canard]

No, not close at all. The slope is closer to 48 dB and it's a ported speaker.

(it was just a reminder...b-r 4eme order.. only reminder ;-) )

 

[EddNog]

The WiiM immature RC isn't causing your speakers to roll off well above 50Hz though. That is still a mystery.

I don’t disagree with this statement at all, but I own a DSPeaker Anti-Mode X2D and its room correction is, indeed, leagues better than that of my WiiM Ultra’s, even with my UMIK-1 used with the WiiM. No contest. Of course it should be for the cost!

-Ed

 

[canard]

I don’t disagree with this statement at all, but I own a DSPeaker Anti-Mode X2D and its room correction is, indeed, leagues better than that of my WiiM Ultra’s, even with my UMIK-1 used with the WiiM. No contest. Of course it should be for the cost!

-Ed

the measured comparison, with constant condition, of the result via wiim and your dspeaker via software like rew (in kind 1/24, little smoothed) would certainly be interesting...
?

 

[EddNog]

the measured comparison, with constant condition, of the result via wiim and your dspeaker via software like rew (in kind 1/24, little smoothed) would certainly be interesting...
?

I'm going to be completely candid with you--I spent weeks trying to get my sound the way I wanted it with WiiM Ultra using a UMIK-1, and, what is mostly driven by lack of L/R correction ability when using the subwoofer/bass management, I simply could not get it to sound how I wanted it to.

Purchased the Anti-Mode X2D, connected everything up, manually adjusted subwoofer phase at the crossover point (80Hz, and found 90-degrees to be optimal), performed the calibration sweep ONCE (Anti-Mode X2D needs readings from only the one listening sweet spot, not upwards of 9 spots like MiniDSP/DIRAC), adjusted subwoofer level and I achieved better sound than I could ever achieve in months of faffing with the WiiM/UMIK-1. In 45 minutes I got my system sounding better than ever with minimal effort compared to months of no success with the WiiM.

Again, most likely the WiiM being unable to perform L/R when using subwoofer management. My room/speaker setup is highly asymmetrical. I cannot change it, I have other life priorities (specifically 7- and 5-year-old sons whose lives dominate our home).

No way in hell I'm ditching my sub or my loudspeakers that I love and need a sub to perform their best.

It is moot point to me and only academic to go faffing with REW. I do have it installed on my laptop. I opened it one time after installing it, saw the eleventeen-thousand different parameters written in a language foreign to me, and immediately shut the app down.

I'm not a sound engineer; I work in finance and have a culinary school college degree. REW might as well be a manual on how to build a rocket to the moon.

-Ed

 

[Vignus]

I'm going to be completely candid with you--I spent weeks trying to get my sound the way I wanted it with WiiM Ultra using a UMIK-1, and, what is mostly driven by lack of L/R correction ability when using the subwoofer/bass management, I simply could not get it to sound how I wanted it to.

Purchased the Anti-Mode X2D, connected everything up, manually adjusted subwoofer phase at the crossover point (80Hz, and found 90-degrees to be optimal), performed the calibration sweep ONCE (Anti-Mode X2D needs readings from only the one listening sweet spot, not upwards of 9 spots like MiniDSP/DIRAC), adjusted subwoofer level and I achieved better sound than I could ever achieve in months of faffing with the WiiM/UMIK-1. In 45 minutes I got my system sounding better than ever with minimal effort compared to months of no success with the WiiM.

It seems just like my story, and my conclusions. I like Wiim Ultra a lot and I use it as a pure streamer, and it works well. As soon as I go fiddling with RC hell breaks loose. I must say that Anti-mode sweeps for around 10 minutes, versus 10 seconds with Wiim, but that's what probably takes to get the sound right.