Volume control at WiiM Ultra vs DAC

[harkpabst]

When using the internal DAC you can have the DAC itself perform the volume adjustment by first ramping to 32b and then applying the correction, or maybe they feed the internal DAC with a 32b stream.

But with an external DAC, unless you send 32b out you don't have that option and thus do lose dynamic range.

Thinking about it some more this sounds very reasonable. At least we don't have any indication (yet) that any digital signal could escape the Ultra's processing at higher than 24 bit resolution.

Luckily, everybody agrees that USB out always sounds a lot better than S/PDIF out, so no matter what WiiM's answer might be we already have a winner.

 

[onlyoneme]

Now using the USB volume control capability of the DAC instead would allow this processing to be done entirely within the external DAC who can then implement a similar 32b scaling or even do analog volume control, it becomes a feature of a given DAC.

Unless it's not a DAC but USB to spdif adapter instead, for example.

 

[hgo58]

Luckily, everybody agrees that USB out always sounds a lot better than S/PDIF out, so no matter what WiiM's answer might be we already have a winner.

Why do you think that?

I don't think everyone agree. It seems that this is just what many expect as it can handle higher sample rate than S/PIF and require a reclocking. In the end you get the same audio data from the WiiM, so there is no obvious reasons for it to sound different or even better.

Anyway, the original question to @WiiM Team was how it works, not what is best.

 

[Burnside]

It seems that this is just what many expect as it can handle higher sample rate than S/PIF

All digital output from WiiM devices is capped at 24/192, even USB so there’s no advantage from that point of view.

 

[harkpabst]

Why do you think that?

I don't think everyone agree. It seems that this is just what many expect as it can handle higher sample rate than S/PIF and require a reclocking. In the end you get the same audio data from the WiiM, so there is no obvious reasons for it to sound different or even better.

I don't think so. I was just sloppily summing up impressionists' common wisdom, following the threads in this forum. Hence the emoji.

Anyway, the original question to @WiiM Team was how it works, not what is best.

Right. I fully got your point.

 

[Mr Ee]

Hence the emoji.

Don'r worry, some of us understood from the start!

 

[Valimir]

I would like to control the volume of my dac/preamp through the WiiMApp as well. As long as the dac can be controlled by rs232 or http apis, this is possible for sonos systems by using the pass through function. One can adjust the volume in the app, the volume is fixed but the volume readable by a script adjusts accordingly. Therefore, one can automatically adjust the volume of the dac by changing the volume of the WiiM device. I liked this function a lot and miss it now! I already asked for this so if anybody wants to do the same, please rate for this: /Future request

 

[pieterv1]

So, do we already know if the WiiM Ultra does hardware volume control of USB DAC's?

 

[hgo58]

So, do we already know if the WiiM Ultra does hardware volume control of USB DAC's?

DAC volume control is part of the USB audio interface protocol but we don't know if WiiM has implemented that.

 

[m_sherzod]

Hello. Found this thread and have a few questions. I have just received my new external DAC (Geshelli J3), connected it via USB and I was surprised that I was still able to control the volume via the Wiim Ultra. I know that most will make fun of me, but I decided to give a try to the hack by the Old Guy HiFi who strongly recommends to use a SMSL PO100 Pro DDC for reclocking before going into an external DAC. So my setup should be as follows:

Wiim Ultra -> USB -> SMSL PO100 Pro -> Optical -> Geshelli J3 -> RCA -> Integrated Amp and Speakers

So my question is will I still be able to adjust volume via the Ultra after this setup? )

P.S.
For those who are curious, the improvement in sound with the J3 is really noticeable, I am really happy. I am rediscovering my favorite tracks for myself again ))

 

[DG77]

Hello. Found this thread and have a few questions. I have just received my new external DAC (Geshelli J3), connected it via USB and I was surprised that I was still able to control the volume via the Wiim Ultra. I know that most will make fun of me, but I decided to give a try to the hack by the Old Guy HiFi who strongly recommends to use a SMSL PO100 Pro DDC for reclocking before going into an external DAC. So my setup should be as follows:

Wiim Ultra -> USB -> SMSL PO100 Pro -> Optical -> Geshelli J3 -> RCA -> Integrated Amp and Speakers

So my question is will I still be able to adjust volume via the Ultra after this setup? )

P.S.
For those who are curious, the improvement in sound with the J3 is really noticeable, I am really happy. I am rediscovering my favorite tracks for myself again ))

I am glad you found improvements!

I also tried the SMSL PO100 Pro, but found no difference in sound, just the added delay with output the USB device adds which messed with the lipsync when using my AppleTV.

 

[m_sherzod]

I am glad you found improvements!

I also tried the SMSL PO100 Pro, but found no difference in sound, just the added delay with output the USB device adds which messed with the lipsync when using my AppleTV.

Thanks. Have you tried RC after introducing the SMSL to sync the speakers? Were you still able to control volume?

 

[hgo58]

Yes the volume control is on the digital signal before any output from the WiiM. So it will always work as long it has not been set to "fixed".

There is absolutely no need for a re-clocker with the WiiM. It may actually introduce more noise into the signal chain.

RC (Room Correction) is just a EQ setting that optimize the frequency response to fit your speakers in your room. Nothing to do with volume control.

 

[DG77]

Thanks. Have you tried RC after introducing the SMSL to sync the speakers? Were you still able to control volume?

Yes I was able to control the volume, and RC also worked. But Wiim can only sync between speakers, it can not remove delays caused by the hardware (usb connected device to external sub). The only way to fix it would be to perform the sync in the AppleTV and add a delay to video, but it does not have that functionality (Because Apple....knows best what is good for you )

 

[m_sherzod]

Yes the volume control is on the digital signal before any output from the WiiM. So it will always work as long it has not been set to "fixed".

There is absolutely no need for a re-clocker with the WiiM. It may actually introduce more noise into the signal chain.

RC (Room Correction) is just a EQ setting that optimize the frequency response to fit your speakers in your room. Nothing to do with volume control.

Ok I get it. I always thought that for volume control you need a preamp, maybe that is not the case in digital signals.

Regarding the reclocker, I already ordered it. If it will not perform as advertised, I have a different use case scenario, so no problem there.)

 

[m_sherzod]

Yes I was able to control the volume, and RC also worked. But Wiim can only sync between speakers, it can not remove delays caused by the hardware (usb connected device to external sub). The only way to fix it would be to perform the sync in the AppleTV and add a delay to video, but it does not have that functionality (Because Apple....knows best what is good for you )

Yes, you don’t mess around with apple stuff, you get what you get))

 

[hgo58]

Ok I get it. I always thought that for volume control you need a preamp, maybe that is not the case in digital signals.

The WiiM is your preamp

Regarding the reclocker, I already ordered it. If it will not perform as advertised, I have a different use case scenario, so no problem there.)

Good. I really don't see any need. Nor for an external DAC to the WiiM if you have an Ultra. The amplifier and speakers is what matters. Use your money there!

 

[m_sherzod]

The WiiM is your preamp

Good. I really don't see any need. Nor for an external DAC to the WiiM if you have an Ultra. The amplifier and speakers is what matters. Use your money there!

Well, I can say in my case I had a really good improvement in sound quality with my external DAC. Maybe depends on the system as well..)