External DAC sound quality thoughts

[Jay]

Hi all,

Just wondering if anyone has attached a good quality external DAC to their WiiM amp (E70/E70 velvet etc) to see if there is any noticeable improvement in sound quality with a decent set of hifi speakers. I love the convenience of hdmi arc in my WiiM along with the EQ and bass management options so ideally I will be keeping it for some time but I am planning on getting some new good quality easy to drive bookshelf speakers and it would be interesting to know if adding an external DAC could enable better sound. I know it's difficult as sound is subjective but any input is appreciated, I'm bored and have the upgrade / new toy itch!


Thanks
John

 

[Mr Ee]

Hi all,

Just wondering if anyone has attached a good quality external DAC to their WiiM amp (E70/E70 velvet etc) to see if there is any noticeable improvement in sound quality with a decent set of hifi speakers. I love the convenience of hdmi arc in my WiiM along with the EQ and bass management options so ideally I will be keeping it for some time but I am planning on getting some new good quality easy to drive bookshelf speakers and it would be interesting to know if adding an external DAC could enable better sound. I know it's difficult as sound is subjective but any input is appreciated, I'm bored and have the upgrade / new toy itch!


Thanks
John

Wiim amp?
No, there are no digital outputs.
Usb out on its way though.

 

[Brantome]

Wiim amp?
No, there are no digital outputs.
Usb out on its way though.

And even with that , there hasn't been any suggestion that you could loop an external DAC's output back into the Amp...

 

[Jay]

Hi,

Thanks for the reply, yes it's the WiiM amp. I was thinking the other way around so connecting the DAC to the analogue inputs on the amp. This would off course make the streaming ability of the amp redundant if just using the inputs connected to the DAC but I'm more interested in sound quality difference experienced by anybody from such a set up. Thanks again.

John

 

[Ian B]

Hi,

Thanks for the reply, yes it's the WiiM amp. I was thinking the other way around so connecting the DAC to the analogue inputs on the amp. This would off course make the streaming ability of the amp redundant if just using the inputs connected to the DAC but I'm more interested in sound quality difference experienced by anybody from such a set up. Thanks again.

John

I have but not a very good external DAC, I connected my Topping E50 to the analogue inputs on the WiiM amp and found it degraded the sound quality a little bit, the DAC inside the WiiM amp is definitely better than the E50. I think it would take a Denafrips Ares DAC to go improve the sound quality of the WiiM amp.

 

[Jay]

I have but not a very good external DAC, I connected my Topping E50 to the analogue inputs on the WiiM amp and found it degraded the sound quality a little bit, the DAC inside the WiiM amp is definitely better than the E50. I think it would take a Denafrips Ares DAC to go improve the sound quality of the WiiM amp.

Thanks that's really interesting and useful to know!

 

[bherren]

I have but not a very good external DAC, I connected my Topping E50 to the analogue inputs on the WiiM amp and found it degraded the sound quality a little bit, the DAC inside the WiiM amp is definitely better than the E50. I think it would take a Denafrips Ares DAC to go improve the sound quality of the WiiM amp.

I don't think this has to do with the DAC in the topping being less good. The analog input of the WiiM amp is, I believe, digitised by the amp then converted back to analog.

So your topping e50 output gets re-digitised then re-DAC'ed, and the weak link here is likely to be the ADC in the WiiM amp.

 

[harkpabst]

I was thinking the other way around so connecting the DAC to the analogue inputs on the amp.

That would actually make no sense at all, because the analogue input is digitised straight away. Whatever you feed into this input will go through the inbuilt ADC and through the inbuilt DAC, no matter what.

 

[Jay]

I don't think this has to do with the DAC in the topping being less good. The analog input of the WiiM amp is, I believe, digitised by the amp then converted back to analog.

So the your topping e50 output gets re-digitised then re-DAC'ed, and the weak link here is likely to be the ADC in the WiiM amp.

Thanks for this info. If that's the case it is a bit annoying as the possible use of an external DAC to increase sound quality is not really an option. Would be good if anybody could confirm that the analogue input from an external DAC would in some way be reprocessed by the internal WiiM amp DAC, I'm not sure why this would happen.

 

[Jay]

That would actually make no sense at all, because the analogue input is digitised straight away. Whatever you feed into this input will go through the inbuilt ADC and through the inbuilt DAC, no matter what.

Thank you. It sounds like you are right, appreciate the input.

 

[Mr Ee]

Thanks for this info. If that's the case it is a bit annoying as the possible use of an external DAC to increase sound quality is not really an option. Would be good if anybody could confirm that the analogue input from an external DAC would in some way be reprocessed by the internal WiiM amp DAC, I'm not sure why this would happen.

Wiim have confirmed this.

tbh, it's a one box streamer, dac and amp. Not really in its raison d'etre to take an external dac's analog input.

 

[Ian B]

Thank you. It sounds like you are right, appreciate the input.

I didn't know that, thanks. Slightly annoying as I wanted to add a decent DAC to the chain, that might be a waste of time and money then.

 

[Ian B]

That would actually make no sense at all, because the analogue input is digitised straight away. Whatever you feed into this input will go through the inbuilt ADC and through the inbuilt DAC, no matter what.

Curious though, what would be the point of including analogue inputs on the WiiM amp if its just going to digitise the analogue signal and then convert that to analogue again?

 

[Brantome]

Curious though, what would be the point of including analogue inputs on the WiiM amp if its just going to digitise the analogue signal and then convert that to analogue again?

Volume control is likely in the digital domain , as are PEQ, EQ etc

 

[Wiimer]

Curious though, what would be the point of including analogue inputs on the WiiM amp if its just going to digitise the analogue signal and then convert that to analogue again?

Some people want to connect their turntable to a WiiM amp. I have the AV receiver pre-out connected to the line-in.

 

[d6jg]

If you aren't going to use the inbuilt streaming capabilty but want to use an external DAC as the input then what point is there in having the WiiM Amp at all? Get something else more suitable.

 

[alpha_zulu]

Why are so many users here looking for better DACs? The WiiM Pro Plus and WiiM Amp have a very good DAC built in, which is absolutely state of the art. DACs are no longer rocket science these days. If they are properly integrated, they are not the weakest link in the chain. Use most of your budget for the speakers and try to optimize your room acoustics as much as possible. This will give you by far the biggest improvement in sound quality. Don't drive yourself crazy over a DAC!

 

[wiimj]

Why are so many users here looking for better DACs? The WiiM Pro Plus and WiiM Amp have a very good DAC built in, which is absolutely state of the art. DACs are no longer rocket science these days. If they are properly integrated, they are not the weakest link in the chain. Use most of your budget for the speakers and try to optimize your room acoustics as much as possible. This will give you by far the biggest improvement in sound quality. Don't drive yourself crazy over a DAC!

Well, that's the audio world where people spend $$$ for amp feet. (btw, your sig says you are also using an external dac integrated into the marantz amp as you are using coaxial cable to the amp).

 

[alpha_zulu]

Both options are permanently wired. Sometimes I use the WiiM's DAC, sometimes the one in the Marantz. Despite intensive listening sessions, I still can't decide whether there is a difference. Both seem to sound largely identical to my ears. I don't miss anything, they both sound great!

 

[luckyrolls]

Along the lines of not being able to hear a difference, to my ears the WIIM amp sounds as good as my Bluesound node going into my Rogue Sphinx Amp. That's $300 vs $2200 and more functionality with the WIIM. I do have ZU DW6 which are easy to drive and my ears have been around many years!