How to think about room correction settings like frequency range and gain?

Mine is at 49Hz but, due to the bass increase due to positioning I have to tame it with around -8dB.

But EQ makes huge difference in my case (I only EQ till 250Hz and sometimes try till 500Hz).

Additionally I use sub-out ON (with no sub) at 42Hz (which I read is the reflex port ressonant frequency. That way I hope not to have much distortion and not to stress the speakers 🤩 don’t ear less bass so it’s my option to maintain it that way.
 
Do you use room correction on them? Huge difference when they are against the back wall due to increase bass level.

The best setup for them was with I believe a 1/3 distance from the back wall (almost no EQ needed if I listened in the right spot), but this was too much intrusive in the room (it’s not a dedicated audio room 😂).

I tried with and without room correction in verious ways. I ended up only correcting the bass mode at 47Hz manually with PEQ.

Either way, soundstage has nothing to do with room correction whatsoever (in my case)… My loudspeakers need enough space around them so that the sound can detach from the box.
 
My loudspeakers need enough space around them so that the sound can detach from the box.
Now, if somebody could explain why soundstage would depend on the amount of space around the speakers ... except for obvious psychological reasons. :)
 
Now, if somebody could explain why soundstage would depend on the amount of space around the speakers ... except for obvious psychological reasons. :)
Sure! 🥴
Not sure if you mean this as a joke?
Anyway, I am certainly not the first person (including many speaker manufacturers) to support that speakers should have space from back and side walls. I will certainly not reason it and not argue with a „community curator“.
I simply make my experience, as you make yours… 🤗
 
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Now, if somebody could explain why soundstage would depend on the amount of space around the speakers ... except for obvious psychological reasons. :)
This is due to the way your ears are perceiving reflected sound from the back wall, the ceiling, the floor, and the side walls. Distance from any of those walls has an effect on quantity as well as frequency of the reflected waves and how they interact with both your ears and each other, so depending on how you space the speakers from the back and side walls as well as do or don’t treat your ceiling and/or floors, you change the effect of reflected sounds, and this has direct impact on general imaging, including perception of soundstage width, height, and depth.

I’m no subject matter expert/professional, so I can’t speak to the precise technical details on what adjustments have what exactly what effect, but know for a fact that it does, and a dramatic one at that.

This is real acoustic science, not psychology or hoodoo voodoo.

-Ed
 
This is due to the way your ears are perceiving reflected sound from the back wall, the ceiling, the floor, and the side walls. Distance from any of those walls has an effect on quantity as well as frequency of the reflected waves and how they interact with both your ears and each other, so depending on how you space the speakers from the back and side walls as well as do or don’t treat your ceiling and/or floors, you change the effect of reflected sounds, and this has direct impact on general imaging, including perception of soundstage width, height, and depth.

I’m no subject matter expert/professional, so I can’t speak to the precise technical details on what adjustments have what exactly what effect, but know for a fact that it does, and a dramatic one at that.

This is real acoustic science, not psychology or hoodoo voodoo.

-Ed
You are absolutely right that early reflections from surrounding surfaces have a significant impact on the sound perceived at the listening location.

Especially the side-wall reflections have a very significant influence on soundstage width, and how diffuse the phantom images will appear.
This is also why wide dispersion loudspeakers are liked by a lot of people. Having wide directivity loudspeakers away from side walls can help create a soundstage that horizontally goes beyond the loudspeakers, and IMHO helps with the feeling of envelopment with stereo content (which is in general not very rich with spatial cues).

This is because side-wall reflections of well-designed wide-directivity loudspeakers will have a spectrum reasonably similar to that of the direct sound, and will act almost like an additional lateral sound source that extends the soundstage width.

Other people want more focused phantom images so they opt for narrow directivity speakers and/or absorption of side-wall reflections (at the cost of soundstage width and a smaller sweet spot).

It seems to be a personal preference decision between two different soundstage presentations.

On the other hand, typical front-firing loudspeakers don't radiate much energy to the back at higher frequencies (one example here), so the reflection from the wall behind will be strongest in low frequencies and therefore cause the strongest interference with the direct sound (SBIR) in the bass range - usually below 300-500Hz or so, depending on the loudspeaker directivity and distance from the wall. I've covered this in detail in this post.

These interreference (SBIR) effects from the wall behind the loudspeaker are definitely audible but I personally mainly hear them as tonality shifts, and haven't really found them that detrimental to soundstage (at least with typical box speakers). That of course doesn't mean that it is impossible for SBIR to impact soundstage perception, just that I personally don't know of any formal research that demonstrated such a connection.

However the SBIR nulls in the >200Hz range (loudspeaker near the wall behind) are simply less deep and less severe than SBIR nulls in the <150Hz range (front of loudspeaker more than 0,6m from the wall behind it), so they are also less audibly offending.
Still, while any kind of audible interference is not ideal, we need to take into account that better alternatives come at the cost of more inconvenience. I've covered those alternatives in detail in the same post linked above.
 
Not sure if you mean this as a joke?
Anyway, I am certainly not the first person (including many speaker manufacturers) to support that speakers should have space from back and side walls. I will certainly not reason it and not argue with a „community curator“.
I simply make my experience, as you make yours… 🤗
You should argue with anybody if you have any proof for your claim except "my experience". ;)

Using speakers far away from any boundaries has already been acknowledged as one way of removing the room's influence. Unfortunately this is mainly limited to rooms that big that their influence is very easy to handle anyway.

As has been shown, placing speakers as close as possible to the front wall clearly doe not go hand in hand with reduced sound stage. "Airy sound needs air around the speaker" is a myth.
 
You should argue with anybody if you have any proof for your claim except "my experience". ;)

Using speakers far away from any boundaries has already been acknowledged as one way of removing the room's influence. Unfortunately this is mainly limited to rooms that big that their influence is very easy to handle anyway.

As has been shown, placing speakers as close as possible to the front wall clearly doe not go hand in hand with reduced sound stage. "Airy sound needs air around the speaker" is a myth.
If it´s a myth for you, so be it! Anyway, why should be your claim more valid than mine? 😂
For most speaker manufactures (and me) it’s a fact! 😊
 
To be fair speaker manufacturers recommend a minimum distance from the wall to obtain the correct bass response without room correction.
No, this is not related to bass response only, but often as well!
As I said I am not going to argue. If some people believe speaker positioning has no influence on soundstage, than, well, they can believe what they want… 😅
I would bet - the same people do not believe that Amps can make a difference too. So be it. I shut up! 🤗
 
No, this is not related to bass response only, but often as well!
As I said I am not going to argue. If some people believe speaker positioning has no influence on soundstage, than, well, they can believe what they want… 😅
I would bet - the same people do not believe that Amps can make a difference too. So be it. I shut up! 🤗
This is all KEF say about it and Monitor Audio say something similar. Does any manufacturer give other reasons?

"For the best low-frequency response, experiment with the distance between your speakers and the front wall (the wall behind the speakers). The typical optimal distance is between 300mm and 1000mm, both speakers should be the same distance from the front wall."
 
This is all KEF say about it and Monitor Audio say something similar. Does any manufacturer give other reasons?

"For the best low-frequency response, experiment with the distance between your speakers and the front wall (the wall behind the speakers). The typical optimal distance is between 300mm and 1000mm, both speakers should be the same distance from the front wall."

I know! This seams not to be exactly at the wall… 😅
 
Sure! 🥴
Not sure if you mean this as a joke?
Anyway, I am certainly not the first person (including many speaker manufacturers) to support that speakers should have space from back and side walls. I will certainly not reason it and not argue with a „community curator“.
I simply make my experience, as you make yours… 🤗
You are right .

Very early reflections is very bad for sound quality .
The precedence effect is kicking in at distances longer than 2 ms, I.e 34,3 cm*2= 68 cm , meaning the ear start selecting sound while the microphone takes up all the sound , so the ear and microphone is working very different . At only 2ms ( 68cm ) , the ear can discover the direction of the sound .


I always put my speakers so the frontwall behind the speaker is more than 45 cm ( 90 cm delayed sound from the frontwall ) away from the drivers , the sound gets noticeable more detailed ,with less early reflections , and the help from some SBIR and later reflections from the sidewalls are needed to make the flawed stereo system sounding more believable .

The optimal acoustic delays from the sidewalls for two channel music is between 20-30ms , this makes the sound more ambient and one doesn’t recognize the stereo system flaws that much .

Unfortunately this demands a very big listening room .

It’s important to know that good 2 channel reproduction needs very different acoustics treatment than 5.1 sound . For greatest sound illusion, 2 channel reproduction needs mostly diffusion, 5.1 needs damping .

A thick floor rug in front of the speakers is needed in both systems.
 
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