The "PERFECT WiiM Product"

[harkpabst]

Amp is not a perishable product . I have mentioned the offer of Cyrus one cast for 650£ new . This is a really good all in one amp that can last for many years and drive almost all speakers properly .

A very personal opinion, but not a fact .

Comparing a still brand - new product with a one - time local special offer of something that ' s been around for five years is certainly not forbidden . It just doesn ' t proof any point .

When you buy an amp first is the amp stage and the rest are secondary. The amp is the basis of the system and it is crucial to be of high quality . The others may change .

The WiiM Amp is not and is not intended to be an integrated amplifier . It's an all - in - one box and everybody knows this . And it is build to a price point, no surprise .

You don ' t even own a WiiM Amp , do you ?

 

[steadyshot]

A very personal opinion, but not a fact .

Comparing a still brand - new product with a one - time local special offer of something that ' s been around for five years is certainly not forbidden . It just doesn ' t proof any point .


The WiiM Amp is not and is not intended to be an integrated amplifier . It's an all - in - one box and everybody knows this . And it is build to a price point, no surprise .

You don ' t even own a WiiM Amp , do you ?

I mentoned this Cyrus model because it is a more complete product vastly more capable and it would be no brainer to buy it at this price . I mentioned it as a benchmark for price and performance for next WiiM iterations . It just does not make sense to produce something cheap if it does not perform as it should just for the sake of low price . Function and performance come first.

Of course every logical person would not buy an amp for using it as a dac or steamer . It is pretty common sense that if you buy an amp this is the most important function the buyer expects to perform.

Of course I don’t own a Wiim amp . So what ?

 

[harkpabst]

... vastly more capable ...

Vastly more capable , especially when it comes to e . g . subwoofer integration , of course .

... and it would be no brainer to buy it at this price .

So much of a no brainer that Cyrus decided to discontinue the entire product range with no successors .

It just does not make sense to produce something cheap if it does not perform as it should just for the sake of low price .

Luckily , this hasn't happened in the case of WiiM , phew !

Of course every logical person would not buy an amp for using it as a dac or steamer . It is pretty common sense that if you buy an amp this is the most important function the buyer expects to perform.

You sound like a broken record . Whoever wants to buy an amplifier for 300 bucks should not and will not consider the product that just happens to be called WiiM Amp.

Of course I don’t own a Wiim amp . So what ?

You are making unfounded judgements , so what ? Asking for an additional , even better WiiM Amp is absolutely fair . I personally might actually buy it . But you try to make it sound like the current Amp was something like a mistake or a product not worth its money , which is plain silly .

 

[steadyshot]

Vastly more capable , especially when it comes to e . g . subwoofer integration , of course .


So much of a no brainer that Cyrus decided to discontinue the entire product range with no successors .


Luckily , this hasn't happened in the case of WiiM , phew !


You sound like a broken record . Whoever wants to buy an amplifier for 300 bucks should not and will not consider the product that just happens to be called WiiM Amp.


You are making unfounded judgements , so what ? Asking for an additional , even better WiiM Amp is absolutely fair . I personally might actually buy it . But you try to make it sound like the current Amp was something like a mistake or a product not worth its money , which is plain silly .

This is my answer to you . I don’t find any value in this product it does not meet any real standards for hi fi listening given that most speakers especially bookshelves are low sensitivity and their real impedance is more near 4 ohms than 8 ohms . The amp is not linear it cannot perform adequately in low frequencies and users are not satisfied with its power performance. It is a half baked product .If you want to sugarcoat be my guest . But the one who is talking silly is probably you.

 

[Karlaka]

Guys, please let's not cross the line of respect.
The idea of this thread is to continue giving our opinions based on our needs and preferences, which by definition, are very personal.
In my particular case, I still very much agree with Steve Woodhouse. Obviously we have common purposes regarding this product.
I think it is logical to conclude that for a value of 300 dollars we cannot expect a super premium product, but I am also convinced that the Wiim Amp is worth much more than what it costs.
I reiterate that in my opinion its weakest part is the amplification stage, which is why I would do without it and lower the cost even further, leaving the choice of power stage to the user. The issue of speakers is another story.
Just my thoughts.

 

[harkpabst]

I don’t find any value in this product ...

You're entitled to your own opinion, for your own use case, nobody can argue against this.

... it does not meet any real standards for hi fi listening given that most speakers especially bookshelves are low sensitivity and their real impedance is more near 4 ohms than 8 ohms.

But please, don't try to make an opinion sound like facts. All dynamic speakers are low sensitivity in absolute terms (with efficiency in the one digit % range, usually around 1%). 60 watts are plenty enough for many homes, even more so when a subwoofer with proper bass management is used.

Erin's video has it's issues (in particular his understanding of multi-tone testing is lacking, Audioholics already announced an article explaining this in more detail and other objective reviewers came to different results), but at least he didn't make the mistake of stating, that the WiiM Amp had problems into 4 ohm speakers. It hasn't, not at all, quite the contrary.

The amp is not linear it cannot perform adequately in low frequencies and users are not satisfied with its power performance.

What you might be refering to as "not linear" is a certain amount of load dependency which is common to all lower and many mid price class D designs. That's not good but also not the end of the world (and it's less of a problem with 4 ohm speakers). Nobody cares about clean power output at 20 Hz with a streamer, DAC, pre-amp and power-amp for 300 bucks, featuring bass management and (soon to come) room correction.

The other stuff you must have read on the Internet. At least on those sites you picked to support your opinion. If this device is not your cup of tea, then be it. That's fine with me. Objectively it's a good device, selling faster than they can make it and providing excellent value and great sounding in many setups. I don't see why it should be replaced. Did I hope for PFFB with the Amp? Yep, sure enoug. But it is still good enough without.

If there is one thing WiiM did wrong then it is letting PCB version 2 hit the shelves. That shouldn't have happened. The reasons are obvious, though.

 

[Steve Woodhouse]

This is my answer to you . I don’t find any value in this product it does not meet any real standards for hi fi listening given that most speakers especially bookshelves are low sensitivity and their real impedance is more near 4 ohms than 8 ohms . The amp is not linear it cannot perform adequately in low frequencies and users are not satisfied with its power performance. It is a half baked product .If you want to sugarcoat be my guest . But the one who is talking silly is probably you.

I think, whilst the criticisms are valid, your post descends into hyperbole.

Not least of which because your criticisms have been centred on Erin’s video review.

So here’s a recent video from Erin of a blind comparison of three amps, including the WiiM. He does not use the same massive overstatements you employ regarding the WiiM. Indeed, it really doesn’t appear to be an issue for him at all.

I think you need to take into account that he’s compared the WiiM with a NAD amp costing $300+, into a pair of $20,000 speakers, and the WiiM’s measured ‘deficiencies’ don’t really get a look in.

 

[Karlaka]

Everything is very quiet here. I'm waiting for the LinkPlay team to contact me to send me a test unit of the Ultra (cuac! )

 

[adias]

Plenty of people use the Wiim Pro Plus directly with a power amplifier, as it has 3 inputs (including 1 analog) the pre already exists as a product

To drive a volume-control-less amp with a WiiM Pro or Pro+ is a major mistake in more ways than one.

 

[wiimj]

With more peq bands, all I want for my pro plus is sub-out. They did talk about adding it to exiting pro and pro plus but it doesn't seem to be the case anymore. Some less important ones are balanced out but I can live without it.

 

[Checki]

That said, in my opinion the perfect Wiim product would be a streamer with the same build quality as the Amp, with the same software, the same outputs and inputs……

Yes, but HDMI input and maybe output would be important for many people too, to make it „perfect“.

 

[bherren]

Yes, but HDMI input and maybe output would be important for many people too, to make it „perfect“.

For me it would be an Ultra with balanced output and a bigger screen and of course depending on what it's like on release maybe an even better phono preamp

 

[harkpabst]

An all-electric two seated roadster with manually operated top, 400 km range, 1100 kg empty weight for less than 25000 € could keep me happy for a while.

 

[castalla]

Something with the cool design flair of the Naim muso 2 but with bluetooth transmit and a software equaliser

 

[cooky560]

Snipped as long post, click the arrow to view the original.

The weakest amp I have, a sherwood s7200, is 20w + 20w into 8 ohms.

I have no issues getting 90db + out of it with any of the speakers in my collection, it just needs the dial to be a bit further around.

This is in a room that's 5m x 5m.

Unless you have real tough speakers, power output is not massively important compared to how it sounds

 

[Jls]

Just came across this thread and have to say, I will not be ditching my Sonos Ports until Wiim supports more services.

Specifically, Sirius XM, Audible, and Spotify , et. al., must run on the box and not require Airplay. Insert your favorite service here.

Since Sonos screwed up their software , I have been forced to research alternatives. What I found was third party apps that not only work, but have nicer interfaces. I found features I didn’t know about.

For example, the Sonos Library supports searching by composer, and when you select a composer, you get a list of albums.

This is the functionality I have been missing. It is the only feature that made me consider Roon. It was hidden behind a clunky interface in the old app, and, of course, it is missing entirely from their current app.

What I have been searching for is a reasonably priced preamp, and the Ultra looks like what I want. But I will still be using Sonos for my streaming source and local library.

 

[Brantome]

WiiM already supports Spotify via Spotify Connect.

 

[Jls]

WiiM already supports Spotify via Spotify Connect.

Can I build a playlist with tracks from all my services and my local library.

 

[azoriusmage]

You all need to watch the episode of the Simpsons where Homer designs a car.

 

[Brantome]

Can I build a playlist with tracks from all my services and my local library.

No. Submit a feature request if you want the to add that