Listening impressions with the WiiM Ultra compared to the WiiM pro+ and compared to other streamers

[onlyoneme]

Yes. So on the SQ front the Ultra wouldn’t gain me anything.

I’m not saying the Ultra isn’t a great product I’m just saying that in my particular case there is no justification for getting one.

I'm not saying it either. It was just an example of the improvement for the existing Pro/Plus setups.

 

[Smartplug]

If more connection matters and sub out, I would say yes. You can get nice sound by getting pro and higher quality dac that would rival ultra. On my system 1, I have pro connected to external dac which also do preamp along with mono block amp feeding Polk legend. Sound transparent and neutral. System 2 wiim amp feeding elac and sub. Sound decent. System 3 not complete awaiting for ultra.

 

[Imsjry]

Addressing the thread topic: Ultra vs other WiiM streamers.

For me the key difference is Ultra's USB out port to connect to an external DAC. If one has an external DAC with a competent USB input - proper filtering/isolation and clock recosntruction, the SQ should be better than through toslink/coax.

I am beta testing the USB out firmware in the Ultra and I like what I hear. Let’s just say that if one knows how to hear (instrument separation, dynamics, soundstage), the output SQ is readily noticed.

Note: It all hinges on the quality of the USB input of the external DAC.

Finally a great post about actual sound quality! The USB out is the only reason I got an Ultra (feeding a Pontus II) and I can’t wait to try it.

 

[jed1]

Its coaxial output is of the higher quality comparing to the Pro/ Plus one.

onlyoneme,

Could you please explain the reason? For example, Is it due to Ultra's clock?

Thanks

 

[onlyoneme]

onlyoneme,

Could you please explain the reason? For example, Is it due to Ultra's clock?

Thanks

I don't know the reason, there was a short discussion about it already. It can be the clock stability which was improved according to WiiM, it can be a matter of low pass filtering. Anyway the waveform looks much better, its symmetry and rise/fall times improved.

 

[steadyshot]

What do you mean by lpf? Is it low pass filter ? What does it do exactly ? Why lpf filter improves the coax out performance of WiiM ultra ?

 

[pieterv1]

What do you mean by lpf? Is it low pass filter ? What does it do exactly ? Why lpf filter improves the coax out performance of WiiM ultra ?

Basic electronics... To filter out unwanted high frequency noise so you end up with only the digital signal which needs to be transmitted. It has nothing to do with the resulting sound. So yes, in a way it improves integrity/stability of the coax output signal.

 

[steadyshot]

Basic electronics... To filter out unwanted high frequency noise so you end up with only the digital signal which needs to be transmitted. It has nothing to do with the resulting sound. So yes, in a way it improves integrity/stability of the coax output signal.

Is the LPF embedded in WiiM ultra power supply ?

 

[pieterv1]

Is the LPF embedded in WiiM ultra power supply ?

I'm not too familiar with audio electronics, but basically different kinds of filters will be spread throughout the device at strategic places to reduce noise, cross-talk, interference... Mostly in the analog sections. The information sent over coax is digital, but the medium - a voltage - is analog so filtering out unwanted frequencies is always a good idea.

The power supply itself should have its own filtering components like coils and capacitors to remove unwanted noise - both from the incoming mains power as well as the output of the switch mode PSU itself.

 

[Smartplug]

I'm not too familiar with audio electronics, but basically different kinds of filters will be spread throughout the device at strategic places to reduce noise, cross-talk etc. The power supply itself should have its own filtering components like coils and capacitors to remove unwanted noise - both from the incoming mains power as well as the output of the switch mode PSU itself.

There’s some here knows their stuff. @onlyoneme is one of the smartest in this forum based not just his measurements but also the theory and design aspect of audio. I enjoy reading his post!

 

[ghulamr]

I loved my Metrum NOS DAC. I bought it around 10 years ago, compared it to many others at that time and was amazed now, that the DAC in the WiiM Pro+ sounds equally good at the fraction of the price!

now this is saying a lot. Metrum NOS R2R DAC's are some of the best on the market. I own both Onyx and Jade and they are my all time favorite. In my system, the WiiM does not even come close.

 

[Smartplug]

now this is saying a lot. Metrum NOS R2R DAC's are some of the best on the market. I own both Onyx and Jade and they are my all time favorite. In my system, the WiiM does not even come close.

R2R dac are complicated to design and expensive. Not many brand offer r2r. I have r2r dac but it wasn’t my cup of tee. It’s in garage collecting spider web.

 

[MCG555]

now this is saying a lot. Metrum NOS R2R DAC's are some of the best on the market. I own both Onyx and Jade and they are my all time favorite. In my system, the WiiM does not even come close.

Mine is an older and earlier version and 1/3 of the price of Jade and 1/2 of the price of Onyx… At that time (10 years ago) it was the easiely the best sounding with my equipment in my room… and clearly distinguishable…

Well, for now - there are small differences, yes, but, it was hard to name them, especially at normal listening volume… It is always tempting to interpret small differences in favor of the pricier own equipment. Really tried to make „kind of a blind test“ - it was hard for me to pick the better sounding one. And it was also kind of hard for me to accept how close this „cheap“ device with internal DAC comes. For the moment I use it now without my Metrum DAC…

 

[pieterv1]

I just learned that the Ultra is actually using the same DAC chip as my current external DAC (SMSL SU-6). I know the actual sound is dependent on the power supply quality and implementation in the circuit, but I'm very curious how they'll compare. Still a nice surprise

 

[mlsstl]

If anyone is looking for some well recorded solo piano to test with, I'm really enjoying this album at the moment. Found it on Qobuz.

 

[alpha_zulu]

Thanks for the tip. It's always impressive how high quality such old recordings can sound!
I also have a little treasure of this kind that I really enjoy listening to:

(Also from Qobuz)

 

[Imsjry]

Just went back and forth between the Ultra internal DAC and a WiiM Pro feeding a $1000+ Pontus II DAC via coax. Both with fixed volume and no EQ or room correction. Not surprisingly, the Pro>Pontus DAC scenario sounds better but what is surprising is how well the Ultra holds its own. If you haven’t heard a more high quality DAC then this Ultra would not make you want for anything. It sounds great!

 

[Musician]

Just went back and forth between the Ultra internal DAC and a WiiM Pro feeding a $1000+ Pontus II DAC via coax. Both with fixed volume and no EQ or room correction. Not surprisingly, the Pro>Pontus DAC scenario sounds better but what is surprising is how well the Ultra holds its own. If you haven’t heard a more high quality DAC then this Ultra would not make you want for anything. It sounds great!

Interesting .
This is evidence that a PRO is good enough as a transport , sounding better with a good external dac than using Ultras internal dac .

My question is :

Can you please check if there is any differences soundwise between pro and ultra used as transports to your Pontus II dac ?

Imsrjy : you got pm

 

[Brantome]

Interesting .
This is evidence that a PRO is good enough as a transport , sounding better with a good external dac than using Ultras internal dac .

My question is :

Can you please check if there is any differences soundwise between pro and ultra used as transports to your Pontus II dac ?

Can’t imagine why one bit perfect signal would be audibly different from another in that setup…

 

[Musician]

Can’t imagine why one bit perfect signal would be audibly different from another in that setup…

Lets hear if there is a sound difference , this guy has a 2000 dollar dac ( Pontus II ) to use as comparison .