Phono Ouput still Low WITH +36db Preamp on Line Input

I just set up the WiiM amp and everything is working and sounding great, with the exception of the volume of vinyl playback via the RCA line in being dramatically lower than other sources, as others have posted. The sound quality is fine, but even at 100% volume it’s only moderately loud. The WiiM Amp replaced a 30 year old JVC receiver that played *very* loud with the same vinyl gear and speakers.

My setup is Audio Technica AT-VM95E MM cartdge > +40db Darlington Labs MM-5 phono preamp > WiiM Amp > 89db Paradigm Studio Reference 20 speakers.
 
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The WiiM Amp has a line in, not a phono in like your amp probably had which would have had a preamp circuit to boost the phono input and apply RIAA equalisation. You really need an external phono pre-amp for your turntable to feed the WiiM Amp.
 
HalSF said:
My setup is Audio Technica AT-VM95E MM cartdge > +40db Darlington Labs MM-5 phono preamp > WiiM Amp > 89db Paradigm Studio Reference 20 speakers.
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As @Fender stated, this setup really should work. It's an absolutely reasonable use case.

Unfortunately, there is no binding standard for analog RCA connections. Modern sources might put out maximum values way in excess of 2 V. Because the analog input is digitized immediately, this input must not be overdriven, no matter what.

Typical phono pre-amps are not necessarily designed with this kind of input in mind. I think that WiiM should allow some digital gain on the analog Input. This would lead to a reduced signal to noise ratio but I don't expect this to be a real problem with records, as there should be plenty of headroom.

This dives into the territory of per-imput sensitivity (yes, please) vs. per-source volume control (not that useful or intuitive).
 
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harkpabst said:
As @Fender stated, this setup really should work. It's an absolutely reasonable use case.

Unfortunately, there is no binding standard for analog RCA connections. Modern sources might put out maximum values way in excess of 2 V. Because the analog input is digitized immediately, this input must not be overdriven, no matter what.

Typical phono pre-amps are not necessarily designed with this kind of input in mind. I think that WiiM should allow some digital gain on the analog Input. This would lead to a reduced signal to noise ratio but I don't expect this to be a real problem with records, as there should be plenty of headroom.

This drives into the territory of per-imput sensitivity (yes, please) vs. per-source volume control (not that useful or intuitive).
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Assuming your suggestion of an increased gain option for the RCA audio in is something that could be provided in a firmware update, that would be awesome.
 
HalSF said:
Assuming your suggestion of an increased gain option for the RCA audio in is something that could be provided in a firmware update, that would be awesome.
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Accompanied by an app update to expose the user interface, yes.
 
HalSF said:
Assuming your suggestion of an increased gain option for the RCA audio in is something that could be provided in a firmware update, that would be awesome.
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You might try a Douk line level booster. About $40 on Amazon.
 
I’ve posted above about experiencing low volume and difficulty getting properly loud sound while playing vinyl through the WiiM Amp Line In input, and I’m trying to understand if the Pre-Gain function can help increase volume. Does it? Or is the pre-gain only useful to adjust *relative* volume between inputs?
 
HalSF said:
I’ve posted above about experiencing low volume and difficulty getting properly loud sound while playing vinyl through the WiiM Amp Line In input, and I’m trying to understand if the Pre-Gain function can help increase volume. Does it? Or is the pre-gain only useful to adjust *relative* volume between inputs?
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That’s odd. I haven’t used the pre gain function. I would imagine that adding gain would introduce distortion. There’s more qualified individuals on this forum for info on pre gain.

But your phono preamp should be providing the proper levels to the line in of the amp. I’m using the Fosi Audio Phono Box X2. It has a stepped dial providing +39, +42, +45 of db. I have no issues at 39db and 42db and listen to vinyl all the time on my WiiM amp.
 
BK308 said:
That’s odd. I haven’t used the pre gain function. I would imagine that adding gain would introduce distortion. There’s more qualified individuals on this forum for info on pre gain.

But your phono preamp should be providing the proper levels to the line in of the amp. I’m using the Fosi Audio Phono Box X2. It has a stepped dial providing +39, +42, +45 of db. I have no issues at 39db and 42db and listen to vinyl all the time on my WiiM amp.
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Thanks. I’m really just trying to find out if increasing the pre-gain setting for the Line In input will increase the volume and make it louder.
 
HalSF said:
Thanks. I’m really just trying to find out if increasing the pre-gain setting for the Line In input will increase the volume and make it louder.
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Hi HalSF,

The pre-gain setting for the Line In input boosts the volume, making the audio louder. Please give it a try and let us know your experience. Thank you!
 
I maxed out the pre-gain setting for Line In and it doesn't solve this issue for me (I'm using a phono preamp) - the output from the Wiim Amp Pro is whisper quiet, even at max volume. Given the resurgence of vinyl, I think this is a big miss for this product, which is really pretty terrific in every other respect. Hopefully they come out with an Amp Ultra or something that addresses this shortcoming. But I think I'm going to have to send this unit back :cry:.

To the extent info on my system is useful for anyone considering this product, my turntable (Technics 1200) is using an AT-150mlx cartridge and Hagerman Bugle2 phono preamp and Davone Mojo speakers.
 
chryses said:
I maxed out the pre-gain setting for Line In and it doesn't solve this issue for me (I'm using a phono preamp) - the output from the Wiim Amp Pro is whisper quiet, even at max volume. Given the resurgence of vinyl, I think this is a big miss for this product, which is really pretty terrific in every other respect. Hopefully they come out with an Amp Ultra or something that addresses this shortcoming. But I think I'm going to have to send this unit back :cry:.

To the extent info on my system is useful for anyone considering this product, my turntable (Technics 1200) is using an AT-150mlx cartridge and Hagerman Bugle2 phono preamp and Davone Mojo speakers.
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You said the output is whisper quiet. Have you checked your phoni preamp?
 
BK308 said:
You said the output is whisper quiet. Have you checked your phoni preamp?
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Yes, no issues with the phono preamp. I've used it with 5+ preamp/amp combos over the years w/o a problem. Up until yesterday I was using it with a Topping preamp. Hooked it back up to the Topping and it's working fine. I have another phono preamp kicking around somewhere that I'm going to try, but I'm not holding my breath.
 
chryses said:
Yes, no issues with the phono preamp. I've used it with 5+ preamp/amp combos over the years w/o a problem. Up until yesterday I was using it with a Topping preamp. Hooked it back up to the Topping and it's working fine. I have another phono preamp kicking around somewhere that I'm going to try, but I'm not holding my breath.
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Have you tried plugging anything else into the Line In to check it works?
 
chryses said:
Yes, no issues with the phono preamp. I've used it with 5+ preamp/amp combos over the years w/o a problem. Up until yesterday I was using it with a Topping preamp. Hooked it back up to the Topping and it's working fine. I have another phono preamp kicking around somewhere that I'm going to try, but I'm not holding my breath.
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Hmm.. 🤔 You might have to raise a ticket with support. I have a similar setup with the WiiM amp (non pro) and use the line in exclusively with my phono preamp. Never had an issue with volume.
 
Whisper quiet even with +10 dB pre-gain is definitely not normal, if the pre-amp's gain is 40 dB in the MM position, as stated.
 
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