The General Subwoofer Thread

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Danny Linguini

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Rather than hijack the other subwoofer thread (more than I already have), I figured it might be fun to start another one that goes into more detail on how folks are using subs instead of just what subs they’re using. There are some folks in there who have some very interesting setups, in addition to folks who are still considering a sub to their rigs. And since a lot of those setups are using WiiM’s bass management capabilities in the Home app, will, I thought it just makes sense.

I just added a SVS SB-1000 Pro, replacing an aging but still very functional JBL PSW1000. I’m still tweaking, as I only connected it up this morning, so I’ll have more to follow in another day or two. Or more. But s far I’m really liking what I’m hearing.

First thing I noticed before anything else, the old JBL - a 100w ported box with a 10” driver - is actually louder than this new SVS, a 325w 12” in a sealed box. I expected there’d be close, but I didn’t expect that result. However, with levels adjusted, the SVS is plenty loud enough at max volume and 0 gain in the Home app’s sub settings. I ran through the sub/speaker sync and then room correction a couple of times, then checked it again using the HouseCurve app. There’s been a bit of mild tweaking throughout the day, but I’m mostly sticking with what RC built. So, while the JBL is louder, it’s in a narrower range. When they say sealed box subs have a more gradual roll-off, they’re not kidding. This little unit puts it out smooth and even throughout its whole range. Color me impressed.

And whoever said a sealed box sub can’t rattle the house off its foundation, I got another thing for ya. I’m listening to some older Dead Can Dance, and one of the tracks (didn’t catch which one) hit a sustained bass note that damn near shook me off the couch. It was deeper and cleaner than anything I’d ever heard out of the JBL. And now Apple Music just threw on something from Rajna by Black Tears (who I’d never heard before), and oh my goodness, gotta hold onto my hat. And the amp volume is only at 33. :eek:

Please feel free to share your sub stories!
 
Danny Linguini said:
Rather than hijack the other subwoofer thread (more than I already have), I figured it might be fun to start another one that goes into more detail on how folks are using subs instead of just what subs they’re using. There are some folks in there who have some very interesting setups, in addition to folks who are still considering a sub to their rigs. And since a lot of those setups are using WiiM’s bass management capabilities in the Home app, will, I thought it just makes sense.

I just added a SVS SB-1000 Pro, replacing an aging but still very functional JBL PSW1000. I’m still tweaking, as I only connected it up this morning, so I’ll have more to follow in another day or two. Or more. But s far I’m really liking what I’m hearing.

First thing I noticed before anything else, the old JBL - a 100w ported box with a 10” driver - is actually louder than this new SVS, a 325w 12” in a sealed box. I expected there’d be close, but I didn’t expect that result. However, with levels adjusted, the SVS is plenty loud enough at max volume and 0 gain in the Home app’s sub settings. I ran through the sub/speaker sync and then room correction a couple of times, then checked it again using the HouseCurve app. There’s been a bit of mild tweaking throughout the day, but I’m mostly sticking with what RC built. So, while the JBL is louder, it’s in a narrower range. When they say sealed box subs have a more gradual roll-off, they’re not kidding. This little unit puts it out smooth and even throughout its whole range. Color me impressed.

And whoever said a sealed box sub can’t rattle the house off its foundation, I got another thing for ya. I’m listening to some older Dead Can Dance, and one of the tracks (didn’t catch which one) hit a sustained bass note that damn near shook me off the couch. It was deeper and cleaner than anything I’d ever heard out of the JBL. And now Apple Music just threw on something from Rajna by Black Tears (who I’d never heard before), and oh my goodness, gotta hold onto my hat. And the amp volume is only at 33. :eek:

Please feel free to share your sub stories!
Click to expand...
Can you link the other thread? I can't seem to find another dedicated subwoofer thread, though I'm not used to these forums anyway. I'll post my sub story in a sec
 
The subwoofer I use is the very device that got me interested in audio back somewhere around 2012 when I was a kid. My grandpa had an original Bose Cinemate system, which is about the equivalent of a good modern Bose soundbar in audio quality (so less than some of the cheapest proper bookshelf speakers), and when he "upgraded" to a cheap Sony 5.1 system, he gave it to my dad. My parents are normal people who don't care about audio, just that they can hear the words in movies and music, but I LOVED listening to music since before I can remember. My mom has pictures of me as a toddler (who hardly sat still) sitting still listening intently to my grandpa's radio, his vinyl player, or people playing instruments live. So, I naturally was curious and set up the little system in my room that I shared with my brother and hooked it up to our sony dvd player, placed a Beach Boys CD in, and sat in wonder listening to it. I then watched my favorite movie at the time: Pirates of the Caribbean: The Curse of the Black Pearl. It was the first time I had heard proper bass and proper stereo separation outside the movie theater, and I was hooked for life.

Fast forward to today, I'm still in college and can't afford much, but I've got the Neumi BS5P (2022 version) and I recently got a WIIM ultra for its eq, bass management, excellent DAC, streaming, hdmi cec, and other stuff. I'm no longer using the little satellite speakers of the Bose system, but I'm using the subwoofer with the sub out crossover from the WIIM (rca splitter to both L and R input because only connecting one had hum in the Bose for some reason) and the whole system sounds fantastic. The BS5P are pretty accurate down to 100Hz, and I've got them eq'd fairly flat with the WIIM, which happens to be my taste, and though the Bose sub and my room aren't accurate at all, it sounds so good to my tastes that I don't have the desire to upgrade (yet, lol). I'm not using the auto room correction because I don't have a measurement mic, and when it uses my phone mic, it sounds terrible (phone mic limitation, not wiim). Instead, I eq'd the speakers according to the measurement recommendation on Erin's Audio Corner, and it's a huge improvement, pretty much got it in line with my taste, which I wasn't expecting tbh.
 
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Krabin said:
Can you link the other thread? I can't seem to find another dedicated subwoofer thread, though I'm not used to these forums anyway. I'll post my sub story in a sec
Click to expand...
Here you go!
T

Thread 'What Sub’s are you using / recommend'

I have a pair of LS50 Meta’s, am interested in a Sub, what are you guys using and experience using the WiiM Amp, and connectivity, using the settings of the Sub Out how do u find it “offloads” the Mains which i would assume would benefit the WiiM Amp at the low end, vs the recommended full range speaker out from Rel. realize will be lots of variations depending on mains, my shortlist - Rel Tzero certainly good budget option, SVS 3000 Micro or Kef KC62 but expensive, oh i don’t want larger (e.g Rel 5X) I like clean / tight bass and must come in White. Room is Medium 5m x 4m. I have...
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Oops - beat me to it! :sleep:
 
Just tried a Bass Mekanik track from the sub demo list, and holy crap - my whole house was shaking. Not my thing, but man I’m now officially amazed at what this little sub can do! It may not be as loud as the JBL, but it’s cleaner and goes noticeably deeper; but most importantly, it’s loud enough for this amp and speakers. For most *normal* listening, you almost don’t know it’s there until you shut it off and hear what the mains aren’t handling well - or at all. But for bass-heavy stuff, you most definitely know it’s there.

Bottom line, I am absolutely thrilled with the SB1000 Pro. For anybody looking for a reasonably priced sub that pairs extremely well with any WiiM amp and decent speakers, I highly recommend giving it a look. If you’re pushing more than 100w per channel, you’ll want something bigger - a ported box, or just a lot more power output in the sub. But for 100w mains, this little box is awesome.
 
Danny Linguini said:
Just tried a Bass Mekanik track from the sub demo list, and holy crap - my whole house was shaking. Not my thing, but man I’m now officially amazed at what this little sub can do! It may not be as loud as the JBL, but it’s cleaner and goes noticeably deeper; but most importantly, it’s loud enough for this amp and speakers. For most *normal* listening, you almost don’t know it’s there until you shut it off and hear what the mains aren’t handling well - or at all. But for bass-heavy stuff, you most definitely know it’s there.

Bottom line, I am absolutely thrilled with the SB1000 Pro. For anybody looking for a reasonably priced sub that pairs extremely well with any WiiM amp and decent speakers, I highly recommend giving it a look. If you’re pushing more than 100w per channel, you’ll want something bigger - a ported box, or just a lot more power output in the sub. But for 100w mains, this little box is awesome.
Click to expand...
Like I said, great sub you got there…even if I might be a bit biased. 😉

-Ed
 
So it’s barely three weeks since I grabbed the SB1000 Pro, and SVS is already trying to seduce me with the new SB-5000 R|Evolution, for the low, low price of just $2k (or $3,799 if I want two!). 15” driver in a sealed box, 2000 watts RMS, and a frequency response of 17-280 Hz. It would thoroughly obliterate the rest of my setup, and prbably half of my house. Then again, if I had that kind of money to blow on a sub, I think the rest of my setup would likely be more on par with it.

I’m just rambling here - I couldn’t be more pleased with my current rig. If I thought I’d want to go with more horsepower, I’d have to think about a bigger listening room, which means I’d have to think about buying a bigger house, which ain’t happening unless I hit Powerball, and then it’ll be something like Seth Green had in The Italian Job (the system so loud it can blow a woman’s clothes off). But until then, right now, in this house, in this living room, every time Apple Music tosses out another new new-age-y thing, I’m blown away again. That exceeds what I was hoping for when I started putting it together. Thank you, WiiM (and Paradigm, and SVS)! 😁
 
My God, how bad am I. I’m already eyeballing a SB2000 Pro. Not seriously, but the fact that I am at all has me deeply concerned, because I know all to well how this usually ends up. Why am I even looking? Well for a very valid reason (in my own mind): I have to nudge the sub level up by a whole dB in the WiiM app for the SB1000 Pro to be heard. A 325 w sub by itself at full volume should carry over 100 w per channel mains, or so I thought, but it doesn’t quite. Obviously a sealed box design takes more power to push the same air as a lesser-powered ported box than I was led to believe (once again, curse you AI). Is this a major problem? Of course not - my system sounds fantastic to me right now. But in plugging my system info into the configurator thingie on the SVS site before ever buying, it did recommend the SB2000 Pro, so maybe it was right and not just pushing the more expensive option. And not at all unlike most of the rest of you, I’m always looking for anything that might make my system even more fantastic-er. Making things even worse is Amazon having open-box units for a LOT less than brand new. I know you more level-headed audiofreaks will help me choose the most responsible path. I still have the as yet untried approach of going USB C to TOSLINK optical unto the Amp Ultra to see how we might do with true lossless to prolong my next fall into insanity. But I know, I just know, it will never be enough.
 
Danny Linguini said:
My God, how bad am I. I’m already eyeballing a SB2000 Pro. Not seriously, but the fact that I am at all has me deeply concerned, because I know all to well how this usually ends up. Why am I even looking? Well for a very valid reason (in my own mind): I have to nudge the sub level up by a whole dB in the WiiM app for the SB1000 Pro to be heard. A 325 w sub by itself at full volume should carry over 100 w per channel mains, or so I thought, but it doesn’t quite. Obviously a sealed box design takes more power to push the same air as a lesser-powered ported box than I was led to believe (once again, curse you AI). Is this a major problem? Of course not - my system sounds fantastic to me right now. But in plugging my system info into the configurator thingie on the SVS site before ever buying, it did recommend the SB2000 Pro, so maybe it was right and not just pushing the more expensive option. And not at all unlike most of the rest of you, I’m always looking for anything that might make my system even more fantastic-er. Making things even worse is Amazon having open-box units for a LOT less than brand new. I know you more level-headed audiofreaks will help me choose the most responsible path. I still have the as yet untried approach of going USB C to TOSLINK optical unto the Amp Ultra to see how we might do with true lossless to prolong my next fall into insanity. But I know, I just know, it will never be enough.
Click to expand...
You’ll get deeper extension with an SB-2000 Pro as well. You may be surprised that there is music down there on some tracks.

SB-2000 is pretty strong. It is able to get deeper than 3000 Micros, which cost a quite bit more (but are a lot smaller). I’m not saying you should definitely do it, but I’m just letting you know that should you do it, you won’t regret it (at least not from the standpoint of improved performance over the SB-1000 Pro). SB-2000 Pro’s performance is MUCH closer to SB-3000 than SB-1000 Pro is to SB-2000 Pro.

-Ed
 
Danny Linguini said:
Well for a very valid reason (in my own mind): I have to nudge the sub level up by a whole dB in the WiiM app for the SB1000 Pro to be heard.
Click to expand...
Serious question: You are joking here, aren't you? ;) That's a matter of gain (once again) not a matter of power.

Danny Linguini said:
Obviously a sealed box design takes more power to push the same air as a lesser-powered ported box than I was led to believe (once again, curse you AI).
Click to expand...
It's not that easy. Ported designs have a certain efficiency advantage right around the tuning frequency, but typical ported subwoofer designs don't follow "clean" and ripple-free alignments anyway.

Having said that, a beefier sub is a beefier sub. So whatever reason you need ... go ahead. :D
 
Danny Linguini said:
My God, how bad am I. I’m already eyeballing a SB2000 Pro. Not seriously, but the fact that I am at all has me deeply concerned, because I know all to well how this usually ends up. Why am I even looking? Well for a very valid reason (in my own mind): I have to nudge the sub level up by a whole dB in the WiiM app for the SB1000 Pro to be heard. A 325 w sub by itself at full volume should carry over 100 w per channel mains, or so I thought, but it doesn’t quite. Obviously a sealed box design takes more power to push the same air as a lesser-powered ported box than I was led to believe (once again, curse you AI). Is this a major problem? Of course not - my system sounds fantastic to me right now. But in plugging my system info into the configurator thingie on the SVS site before ever buying, it did recommend the SB2000 Pro, so maybe it was right and not just pushing the more expensive option. And not at all unlike most of the rest of you, I’m always looking for anything that might make my system even more fantastic-er. Making things even worse is Amazon having open-box units for a LOT less than brand new. I know you more level-headed audiofreaks will help me choose the most responsible path. I still have the as yet untried approach of going USB C to TOSLINK optical unto the Amp Ultra to see how we might do with true lossless to prolong my next fall into insanity. But I know, I just know, it will never be enough.
Click to expand...
nothing prevents you from turning off the main speakers and listening to the subwoofer alone...seeing the excursion levels of the membrane on pieces that seem to require a lot of it at high volume....maybe give you a little idea of what is really going on.... ;-)
 
harkpabst said:
Serious question: You are joking here, aren't you? ;) That's a matter of gain (once again) not a matter of power.


It's not that easy. Ported designs have a certain efficiency advantage right around the tuning frequency, but typical ported subwoofer designs don't follow "clean" and ripple-free alignments anyway.

Having said that, a beefier sub is a beefier sub. So whatever reason you need ... go ahead. :D
Click to expand...
Yes, it was definitely a joke. Of all the pieces to this never-ending puzzle, a 1 dB gain on the sub is probably one of the most insignificant. As I said, I’m very happy with the result.

And yeah, I did learn quite a bit about ported vs sealed box subs doing my research before this last purchase, not to mention the very plain differences experienced after the fact. As for beefier is beefier, again I’m quite happy with this current setup, I’m just always curious about what’s out there that could make it better without putting me in the poor house. The next step up in SVS is high up on the list, IF a next step is ever going to actually be taken. Right now, that’s a maybe down the road thing.
 
Mr Ee said:
The next step up is some Paradigm Founders ;)
Click to expand...
Yeah … well, remember staying out of the poor house (not to mention the doghouse) is kind of a key consideration. Anything in that series is well above my means or needs. The Monitor SE’s are doing me just fine, actually better than I had expected. As it is, the wife almost freaked when she saw these for the first time. Before these I had only bookshelfs, the last of which were tiny. While she’s gotten used to these towers now, they were a bit of a shock at first. And they’re not even big towers. She’d probably vapor lock if she ever came home to see those Founder monsters in the living room. Nah, I couldn’t live with myself for even thinking about something like that.
 
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