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That’s the main reason why I don’t use it, and I choose to use the optical option instead.
WiiM Ultra Firmware v5.2.714249 - Apr 18, 2025
- Thread starter WiiM Team
- Start date
Fully agree.
But keep in mind that @Wiimer and me are two while you are just one person, so our whishes naturally have higher priority!
And I mean it, of course. Don't know who threw in these emojis ...
hgo58
Major Contributor
You two can define the AoatWwTVio "enabled" functionality and I take care of the "disabled" functionalityFully agree.
But keep in mind that @Wiimer and me are two while you are just one person, so our whishes naturally have higher priority!
And I mean it, of course. Don't know who threw in these emojis ...
Actually I am thinking about getting a HDMI ARC to RCA converter, as I don't have a free optical input. Only drawback would be the lack of volume control via the TV remote. This CEC/ARC is too unstable.
Incognito
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I encountered this problem. This is how I resolved it:
I also started having "massive" lip sync issues today. The automatic Sync Audio did not fix the problem. Manually adjusting the Sync Audio did nothing to fix the problem either. What cured the issue is I went to my TV settings and changed the TV ARC output from "Stereo" to "Pass Through" and DD/DTS. Apparently some devices have ARC that has Lip Sync Correction. Maybe this is what corrected the problem. Not sure, all I know is the Lip Sync issue went away.
Incognito
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FWIW, here is the support FAQ on how WiiM expects HDMI and CEC to behave, not that all external devices behave as they expect. I imagine that this is due to how all of the different TV manufacturers implement CEC. It is notoriously complicated to implement CEC contol over all of the different devices out there whether the protocol is somewhat standardized or not.
Introduction to WiiM Devices HDMI ARC Behaviors
How To Use Audio Input Ports of the WiiM Ultra?
Introduction to WiiM Devices HDMI ARC Behaviors
How To Use Audio Input Ports of the WiiM Ultra?
hgo58
Major Contributor
Yes. WiiM is referring this in the first post.
All is actually working as described. They just don't describe how the TV is expected to behave in some of these cases. And that is where the issues are.
There are also a somewhat unclear used of the terms, like "HDMI mode". I don't know what exactly that is.
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I am using a 3 way rotary optical switch to get around only having one optical input.
If your Bravia supports Alexa, I believe you could also use Smart Plug and Routine.You two can define the AoatWwTVio "enabled" functionality and I take care of the "disabled" functionality
Actually I am thinking about getting a HDMI ARC to RCA converter, as I don't have a free optical input. Only drawback would be the lack of volume control via the TV remote. This CEC/ARC is too unstable.
Simply say "Alexa, TV", to turn TV on after turned off Ultra.
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The choice of terms is confusing, particularly in this case. In the WHA for my ULTRA, HDMI mode is labeled "TV." Here is a clip from a FAQ for how to select audio input for the WiiM Amp and Amp Pro. Note that the input option for TV has an HDMI icon. It is never made clear that the "TV" audio input mode is what is often referred to in documentation as the HDMI mode.
How to Select Audio Input
Manually Select Audio Input
To play audio from the connected input, manually select an audio input on your WiiM Amp or WiiM Amp Pro by following these steps:
- Open the WiiM Home App.
- Navigate to the Devices tab.
- Choose your device or group where you want the audio to play.
- Navigate to the Browse tab, scroll down, and select the appropriate input option: TV, Line In, or Optical In.
@hgo58 - as a reminder, I am the author of https://forum.wiimhome.com/threads/...n-standby-to-use-tv-speakers.4925/#post-81189 which MAY have originated the feature enhancement, not sure if the only such request.
I've only now had a chance to play with the new firmware, but it does seem to sort of do what I want - it appears to me that IF the TV is set to TV speakers, it will keep that state on next power on and ignore the WiiM. And TV volume does not immediately wake up the WiiM (as it did before regardless of the WiiM CEC setting).
If, however, 1) the TV state on power off was to output to WiiM, it will keep that setting, whereby the sound will go into a black hole if the WiiM is not listening. Or 2) if the WiiM is cycled to the TV input, it will make the TV use it; this is not sticky and cycling to another input will revert to TV speakers at their previous volume (even if it was zero).
I am completely fine with #2. I am a little bothered by #1 being sticky since I have to switch out of the "fancy audio" mode explicitly rather then defaulting to TV for the many more numerous quiet listening sessions, but it's ultimately workable.
Is that not what you see? It's a bit hard to follow the entire conversation above. Are we down to differences between TV manufacturers' behaviors (mine is a Samsung)? I think my previous AV processor solved this with the much bigger hammer of keeping the HDMI circuit completely unpowered in standby, but that had its own set of problems.
Unlike you, I never saw the beta work since I lost patience during the long months of inactivity, then life intervened. This is the first time I can have the targeted TV / Hifi mode that I wanted, and I'm pretty excited about that.
I would prefer it if #1 (TV's HDMI output being sticky) didn't happen or at least WiiM would still switch to the TV input by itself - after all, this setting is about the TV output behavior not the WiiM input. But as it is, it's pretty workable. Maybe more testing needed.
I've only now had a chance to play with the new firmware, but it does seem to sort of do what I want - it appears to me that IF the TV is set to TV speakers, it will keep that state on next power on and ignore the WiiM. And TV volume does not immediately wake up the WiiM (as it did before regardless of the WiiM CEC setting).
If, however, 1) the TV state on power off was to output to WiiM, it will keep that setting, whereby the sound will go into a black hole if the WiiM is not listening. Or 2) if the WiiM is cycled to the TV input, it will make the TV use it; this is not sticky and cycling to another input will revert to TV speakers at their previous volume (even if it was zero).
I am completely fine with #2. I am a little bothered by #1 being sticky since I have to switch out of the "fancy audio" mode explicitly rather then defaulting to TV for the many more numerous quiet listening sessions, but it's ultimately workable.
Is that not what you see? It's a bit hard to follow the entire conversation above. Are we down to differences between TV manufacturers' behaviors (mine is a Samsung)? I think my previous AV processor solved this with the much bigger hammer of keeping the HDMI circuit completely unpowered in standby, but that had its own set of problems.
Unlike you, I never saw the beta work since I lost patience during the long months of inactivity, then life intervened. This is the first time I can have the targeted TV / Hifi mode that I wanted, and I'm pretty excited about that.
I would prefer it if #1 (TV's HDMI output being sticky) didn't happen or at least WiiM would still switch to the TV input by itself - after all, this setting is about the TV output behavior not the WiiM input. But as it is, it's pretty workable. Maybe more testing needed.
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@harkpabst - I am guessing you were running with the CEC option off before it got replaced by this switch? Since CEC on has been behaving this way - reverting to the TV speakers when the Ultra goes a away from the TV input - for months now.
Can you just turn down the volume on the TV speakers to zero? My TV keeps this setting independently of the WiiM so I could have "never a peep from TV speakers" if I wanted. Myself, I have an infrequent (seasonal really) case for TV speakers playing a low-volume game when the music is playing for the party, but I wouldn't really care about having to manually switch both since it's rare.
In my feature request, I did say this probably needed to be a separate toggle rather than replacing CEC, since the power on and power off aspects (which include switching to / away from WiiM inputs) are different for different folks. Looks like they tried to do it with one and it might not work well for everyone.
Can you just turn down the volume on the TV speakers to zero? My TV keeps this setting independently of the WiiM so I could have "never a peep from TV speakers" if I wanted. Myself, I have an infrequent (seasonal really) case for TV speakers playing a low-volume game when the music is playing for the party, but I wouldn't really care about having to manually switch both since it's rare.
In my feature request, I did say this probably needed to be a separate toggle rather than replacing CEC, since the power on and power off aspects (which include switching to / away from WiiM inputs) are different for different folks. Looks like they tried to do it with one and it might not work well for everyone.
hgo58
Major Contributor
Alexa is not supported and I don't use Alexa anyway.
I will have to live with unplugging the HDMI cable when not used
I don't know if @harkpabst will take you up on that suggestion, but as you say, it is possible to mute the TV.
However, it still remains that the TV (not the WiiM) is outputting audio. This kills the seamless input switching feature that used to be possible.
Previously in FW it worked like this...
I am watching Netflix on the TV in the living room, stop the movie, press the preset button on the WiiM remote to listen to music in the kitchen. The WiiM stops the audio on the TV and plays the music. I finish my work in the kitchen, return to the living room a short time later and stop the music. Then I play Netflix again, and after a few seconds the WiiM input switches automatically to HDMI and the TV audio comes out of the WiiM.
With the current FW, when I play Netflix again, the WiiM input does not switch. Because it is the TV speakers that are outputting the audio.
The "seamless experience" as the stubborn @WiiM Support calls it is already lost and a relic of the past.
hgo58
Major Contributor
That sounds like the HDMI auto sensing is no longer working. I don't think the CEC functionality has been changed with this latest firmware.
The HDMI auto sensing was part of the optical auto sensing option but that has been removed, so I don't know how it is working now.
In your use case can you select TV input on the Ultra or ARC output on the TV?
Interestingly no, I've been using the CEC = on setting and sound never was played through the TV speakers. We power off the entire media system every night with a dumb strip and occasionally their would be no sound at all from the TV after powering up the next day, but this happened rarely and the likelihood of it happening had been constantly decreased over time. It was close to perfect as of late.
This is with a Samsung TV as well. IIRC the sound output can be set to the external audio system only if it has been detected with my model. There's no way to force mute the internal speakers.
The family has come to expect the comfort of using the TV remote for managing the volume (and rightly so, I think), so this isn't an option either. It wouldn't make sense to me to now teach them whichbremote to use for what. I could have used the optical input from the start, but in my book, the default use case for including an HDMI ARC input is to have it process the sound (and offer the comforts of CEC).
You could be right here.
At least, everybody agrees that the current solution doesn't please either camp fully. And I must repeat that it's specifically unhelpful for those using ARC the way it's primarily designed.
@Wiimer described one typical scenario quite well. Sometimes there are reasons to keep the TV on but listening to something else. Having to switch off the TV prior to switching to a different source would be totally against the usual WiiM design rules. At least, switching off the TV with AoatWwTVio disabled doesn't switch off the Ultra, but that's of little help since my use case requires AoatWwTVio to be on, anyway.
I don't think so, because even if I switch the WiiM input from HDMI to Wi-Fi, the TV audio continues to be output from the TV speakers, so the auto-sensing does not work in the first place.
It is possible, but why should I have to do the extra work that I didn't need to do before?
hgo58
Major Contributor
Unfortunately the new "Smart" HDMI is not smart at all. It may have solved some use cases but messed up many others. And the logic behind it is hard to see.
I still have the issue that my TV changes to ARC output even when the WiiM is in standby. That is not smart.
I think we would all be happy if AoatWwTVio was returned to the CEC toggle, and after regaining its previous functionality, shut off ARC and CEC completely when CEC is off, but I guess it's not that easy, is it?
(or add a TV speaker output button).
hgo58
Major Contributor
Yes. Except for the standby CEC issues, it worked better before.I think we would all be happy if AoatWwTVio was returned to the CEC toggle, and after regaining its previous functionality, shut off ARC and CEC completely when CEC is off, but I guess it's not that easy, is it?
(or add a TV speaker output button).
As I have started before, the beta test version I reported back on was actually working in all the use cases I could think of. That had the CEC Power Control option and the HDMI auto sensing option.
Off topic, but the customizable preset buttons on the WiiM remote were promised from the beginning, but have yet to be realized.
Assigning a "TV speakers turn on/off" function to a preset button and forcing them to switch output destinations would surely put a smile back on @hgo58's face
.@WiiM Support
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