Need more power for my speakers

[Autistic Bob]

Recently my NAD C350 amp died. On paper it seemed the Vibelink amp should match the C350's 60 watts per channel into 8Ω - but I've lost most of my volume and perhaps some of the sound's sharp brightness at lower volume levels.

Should I replace the Vibelink? with what?

I use a Wiim Ultra as the pre-amp and streamer. Speakers are Wharfedale Mach 9's - big beasts but highly efficient at 94Db

 

[slartibartfast]

Recently my NAD C350 amp died. On paper it seemed the Vibelink amp should match the C350's 60 watts per channel into 8Ω - but I've lost most of my volume and perhaps some of the sound's sharp brightness at lower volume levels.

Should I replace the Vibelink? with what?

I use a Wiim Ultra as the pre-amp and streamer. Speakers are Wharfedale Mach 9's - big beasts but highly efficient at 94Db

Is it too quiet at maximum volume?

 

[Shotgun Rico]

3e Audio A7

 

[Autistic Bob]

s it too quiet at maximum volume?

Yup - even at 70%

 

[slartibartfast]

Yup - even at 70%

70% isn't maximum volume though. The gain of the Vibelink is probably lower than the NAD.

 

[HansD-NL]

The input sensitivity of the NAD C350 line inputs is 325mV (A better choice than the decades old standard of 150mV) so it reached full power "earlier" (volume knob scale) than the Vibelink but no worries, just turn the Vibelink to max and control the volume with the Ultra, it's normal that you have to turn it up more than with your previous NAD amp. The Vibelink has more than enough power for the vast majority of speakers in domestic settings.

 

[EddNog]

Yup - even at 70%

Unless you're not getting enough loudness at 100%, this is not a problem.

Modern amps don't clip just because they're running at low attenuation. In fact, devices running digital volume sound better and better as you approach unity gain.

-Ed

 

[harkpabst]

Recently my NAD C350 amp died. On paper it seemed the Vibelink amp should match the C350's 60 watts per channel into 8Ω - but I've lost most of my volume and perhaps some of the sound's sharp brightness at lower volume levels.

Should I replace the Vibelink? with what?

I use a Wiim Ultra as the pre-amp and streamer. Speakers are Wharfedale Mach 9's - big beasts but highly efficient at 94Db

Do you have the WiiM Ultra set to 2 V output voltage (when using the RCA connection)?

Have you tried the optical connection?

Gain (or sensitivity) has nothing to do with power. As @EddNog said, as long as it's loud enough at 100 % there is no problem. Certain sourced (like e.g. HDMI ARC) might need some pre-gain applied, simply because the source is too quiet.

 

[Autistic Bob]

70% isn't maximum volume though. The gain of the Vibelink is probably lower than the NAD.

It is too quiet at 70% volume and way too quiet at 100% !!

 

[Autistic Bob]

Do you have the WiiM Ultra set to 2 V output voltage (when using the RCA connection)?

Have you tried the optical connection?

Gain (or sensitivity) has nothing to do with power. As @EddNog said, as long as it's loud enough at 100 % there is no problem. Certain sourced (like e.g. HDMI ARC) might need some pre-gain applied, simply because the source is too quiet.

The Wiim Ultra line out level is 2 Vrms.

The Vibelink volume dial is set at 100%. I adjust volume using the Wiim Ultra and the setting is usually in the 80-100% range. At 70% on the Ultra, volume is much quieter than I'd expect. At 100% is is much much much much quieter than I'd expect it to be - at those levels it would be simple to conduct a conversation.

On my NAD amp, the volume was set at 25% and the Wiim Ultra volume settings would be between 30-60% depending on how much volume I wanted. If the NAD volume was set to 50% and the Ultra at 60-75% I'd rattle my neighbours windows with sound pressure - and communicating with anyone would need shouting, screaming, and sign language.

The NAD amp couldn't take a digital input. Should I try that on the Vibelink? if so, will I loose all the EQ settings the Ultra provides?

90% of the time, I stream music to Spotify Connect using my tablet as the control/selection method. Sometimes when I really do want my music louder, I can do better by running the Spotify app on my TV or the Google TV streamer and using the Ultra's HDMI input.

 

[Shotgun Rico]

If the amp doesn’t sound right for YOU, get an amp that can match it and that YOU like with your speakers. Obviously your 95 db sensitive speakers aren’t a match for the Vibelink. Why not just get the same amp that you had before?

 

[EddNog]

The Wiim Ultra line out level is 2 Vrms.

The Vibelink volume dial is set at 100%. I adjust volume using the Wiim Ultra and the setting is usually in the 80-100% range. At 70% on the Ultra, volume is much quieter than I'd expect. At 100% is is much much much much quieter than I'd expect it to be - at those levels it would be simple to conduct a conversation.

On my NAD amp, the volume was set at 25% and the Wiim Ultra volume settings would be between 30-60% depending on how much volume I wanted. If the NAD volume was set to 50% and the Ultra at 60-75% I'd rattle my neighbours windows with sound pressure - and communicating with anyone would need shouting, screaming, and sign language.

The NAD amp couldn't take a digital input. Should I try that on the Vibelink? if so, will I loose all the EQ settings the Ultra provides?

You should definitely use digital instead at least as a test. All that said, any WiiM amplifier device I have ever used has a fairly low gain. Since you’re coming from a different amplifier with rather high gain, the disparity would seem quite obvious.

It sounds almost as if, for whatever reason, you need an amp with more gain than LinkPlay stuff.

-Ed

 

[Autistic Bob]

Why not just get the same amp that you had before?

Sadly financial pressure is real

The Vibelink "seemed" an economic pathway forward with my amp starting to fail and overheat (not uncommon with Class A amps in hot climates). The Vibelink was about a quarter of the cost of a replacement NAD amp.

 

[Shotgun Rico]

Class A? The 350 amp class is ab. Are you talking about the NAD 3050 which is $1899 on Crutchfield or the 350 which is around 350 euros?

 

[Shotgun Rico]

Return the Vibelink and get the 3e Audio A7 with the 10amp power supply. 140 watts to your beastly speakers should be plenty. I think the amp is on sale at Amazon. All in for under $350

 

[slartibartfast]

The Wiim Ultra line out level is 2 Vrms.

The Vibelink volume dial is set at 100%. I adjust volume using the Wiim Ultra and the setting is usually in the 80-100% range. At 70% on the Ultra, volume is much quieter than I'd expect. At 100% is is much much much much quieter than I'd expect it to be - at those levels it would be simple to conduct a conversation.

On my NAD amp, the volume was set at 25% and the Wiim Ultra volume settings would be between 30-60% depending on how much volume I wanted. If the NAD volume was set to 50% and the Ultra at 60-75% I'd rattle my neighbours windows with sound pressure - and communicating with anyone would need shouting, screaming, and sign language.

The NAD amp couldn't take a digital input. Should I try that on the Vibelink? if so, will I loose all the EQ settings the Ultra provides?

90% of the time, I stream music to Spotify Connect using my tablet as the control/selection method. Sometimes when I really do want my music louder, I can do better by running the Spotify app on my TV or the Google TV streamer and using the Ultra's HDMI input.

Is the HDMI input louder than using Spotify Connect? What is the pregain setting for all your inputs?

 

[Wiimer]

The Vibelink volume dial is set at 100%. I adjust volume using the Wiim Ultra and the setting is usually in the 80-100% range. At 70% on the Ultra, volume is much quieter than I'd expect. At 100% is is much much much much quieter than I'd expect it to be - at those levels it would be simple to conduct a conversation.

I think there’s definitely something wrong somewhere.

Have you tried resetting the Vibe? (Press and hold the power button on the back panel for 10 seconds.)

It might also be worth reconnecting the power cables for the Vibe and Ultra and rebooting them. Also, please double-check for loose speaker connections or any issues with the speaker’s attenuator.

Also, is it possible to connect other speakers to the Vibe for testing?


My Vibe is connected to the Ultra via an optical connection.

Ultra
Volume limit: 100%
Volume: 60%

Vibe
Volume: 60%

Speaker: Focal Chora 806 (89 dB/m)


When I play a 1 kHz sine wave from Spotify with this setup, I get a volume of 85 dB/m.




Could you install a sound level meter app on your smartphone and measure the volume at a distance of 1 meter from the speaker?

 

[Autistic Bob]

Are you talking about the NAD 3050 which is $1899 on Crutchfield or the 350 which is around 350 euros?

Here in Australia the NAD 3050 is around $2,800 and the Vibelink was $499 - as I said economic factors limited my purchase.

 

[slartibartfast]

Here in Australia the NAD 3050 is around $2,800 and the Vibelink was $499 - as I said economic factors limited my purchase.

You did say yours was the C350 though

 

[Autistic Bob]

Is the HDMI input louder than using Spotify Connect? What is the pregain setting for all your inputs?

Yes, the HDMI is considerably louder than the Ultra's ethernet input.

Pre-gain is set to 0 on all inputs. I guess I'm a plug and play sort of person (until I have the brain space to look deeper). Cabled ethernet is the main input with Spotify connect used 85% of the time; the remaining 15% is TV HDMI with Netflix, YouTube and Spotify apps from a Google TV streamer.

Ultra output is rca line out to the amp. Line out levek 2Vrms, DAC filter type Corrected minimum phase fast roll-off filter - 1 of the 2 recommended options.