Popping/clicking when switching tracks

[AdieH]

Hi all,

I've had this problem since I got my WiiM Mini about 3 months ago. Each time you click "next", or select a new track, in each case while another track is playing, there is a pause (which is normal) followed my a clicking/popping sound before it plays the selected track. There is no clicking/popping if you simply let the one track play and then move to the next, automatically.

I am using Qobuz (thru the WiiM app), but this also happens with Spotify connect.

Hardware is a Denafrips Ares II DAC with a QED cable optical cable.

The release notes from a few months ago identified this as an issue, but it said it was solved. I don't think it is. (The issue was described as:"Popping noise coming through speaker's when changing tracks when using optical output to DAC optical in").

When I logged a ticket (after the release notes claimed it was "solved") they said they are working on it, suggesting it was indeed, not solved. But, the issue persists.

Any ideas? Does anyone else have the same issue, or the same hardware, with no issue?

Cheers,

Adrian

 

[Cincyret]

When using the WIIM Android app or TIDAL Connect Android app or Audirvana Studio (Mac) my WIIM Mini transmits a loud pop/crack sound to my SMSL M200 dac when changing tracks manually. It also happens when I change from e.g. TIDAL to a radio station. My experience is pretty much the same as previous contributors to this thread.

So I tried connecting my WIIM Mini to an iFi Audio Spdif Purifier #2 via Spdif and plugged the Spdif Purifier #2 into my SMSL M200 dac via Coaxial. This set up has completely eliminated the loud pop/crack sound. Please note that the iFi Audio Spdif Purifier #2 is also a Spdif/Coaxial converter.

I have no idea whether other manufacturers' Spdif/Coaxial converters will produce the same positive result.

I have tried both the original version of iFi Audio's Spdif Purifier and the more recent #2 version. I was using them in other systems. They are both equally effective to completely eliminate the WIIM Mini's pop/crack sound with no appreciable loss of audio quality, at least as far as I can hear.

So if you have a spare Spfif/Coaxial converter why not try it and see if it works?

If I understand, you have Ethernet/Wi-Fi in and SPDIF/Toslink (optical) out. You then convert then the SPDIF to Coax with the ifi purifier. This solves your problem. Two questions (I may have missed the answer in a prior post): (1) Why don't you use the Coax out port on the WiiM? (2) In my case, I get intermittent crackling from both output ports (SPDIF & Coax) from the optical in port, so converting one to another probably won't work. My apologies (Optical in crackling-not audio out) if I've hijacked this thread.

 

[GMcC]

If I understand, you have Ethernet/Wi-Fi in and SPDIF/Toslink (optical) out. You then convert then the SPDIF to Coax with the ifi purifier. This solves your problem. Two questions (I may have missed the answer in a prior post): (1) Why don't you use the Coax out port on the WiiM? (2) In my case, I get intermittent crackling from both output ports (SPDIF & Coax) from the optical in port, so converting one to another probably won't work. My apologies (Optical in crackling-not audio out) if I've hijacked this thread.

My WIIM Mini does not have an ethernet port. The Mini connects to the internet only via WiFi.

Unlike the WIIM Pro which connects to the internet either via ethernet or WiFi.

The WIIM Mini does not have a Coaxial output. Its sole digital output is via Toslink.

The WIIM Pro differs from the Mini by having both Toslink and Coaxial digital outputs.

When I connect my Mini's Toslink output to either of my iFi Audio Sdif Purifiers connected to my SMSL M200 dac solely via Coaxial the pop/crack sound is completely eliminated with no audible deterioration in sound quality. This configuration solves the problem.

However if I connect the Toslink ouput from either of my iFi Sdif Purifiers solely to the Toslink input of my SMSL dac the pop/crack is not eliminated. It stays exactly the same. This configuration does not solve the problem.

The iFi Spdif Purifiers have a Toslink and a Coaxial output. They both operate at the same time.

Please note that if I connect both outputs to my SMSL dac at the same time and select solely the Coaxial input on the dac (i.e. Toslink input turned off) the pop/crack sound is not eliminated. This configuration does not solve the problem. That may sound implausible but that's exactly what happens.

For the sake of confirmation I have repeated the above configurations a number of times, always with the same result.

When I substitute my SMSL dac for my iFi xDSD dac connected via Toslink to an iFi Spdif Purifier connected to the WIIM Mini via Toslink the pop/crack is completely eliminated. This configuration solves the problem. The iFi xDSD does not have a coaxial input.

I am not an audio/electronics engineer so I am unable to offer any explanation.

 

[Cincyret]

My WIIM Mini does not have an ethernet port. The Mini connects to the internet only via WiFi.

Unlike the WIIM Pro which connects to the internet either via ethernet or WiFi.

The WIIM Mini does not have a Coaxial output. Its sole digital output is via Toslink.

The WIIM Pro differs from the Mini by having both Toslink and Coaxial digital outputs.

When I connect my Mini's Toslink output to either of my iFi Audio Sdif Purifiers connected to my SMSL M200 dac solely via Coaxial the pop/crack sound is completely eliminated with no audible deterioration in sound quality. This configuration solves the problem.

However if I connect the Toslink ouput from either of my iFi Sdif Purifiers solely to the Toslink input of my SMSL dac the pop/crack is not eliminated. It stays exactly the same. This configuration does not solve the problem.

The iFi Spdif Purifiers have a Toslink and a Coaxial output. They both operate at the same time.

Please note that if I connect both outputs to my SMSL dac at the same time and select solely the Coaxial input on the dac (i.e. Toslink input turned off) the pop/crack sound is not eliminated. This configuration does not solve the problem. That may sound implausible but that's exactly what happens.

For the sake of confirmation I have repeated the above configurations a number of times, always with the same result.

When I substitute my SMSL dac for my iFi xDSD dac connected via Toslink to an iFi Spdif Purifier connected to the WIIM Mini via Toslink the pop/crack is completely eliminated. This configuration solves the problem. The iFi xDSD does not have a coaxial input.

I am not an audio/electronics engineer so I am unable to offer any explanation.

Thanks for such a detailed explaination. I see my questions were somewhat off topic. Now I understand (??). Thanks again.

 

[onlyoneme]

My WIIM Mini does not have an ethernet port. The Mini connects to the internet only via WiFi.

Unlike the WIIM Pro which connects to the internet either via ethernet or WiFi.

The WIIM Mini does not have a Coaxial output. Its sole digital output is via Toslink.

The WIIM Pro differs from the Mini by having both Toslink and Coaxial digital outputs.

When I connect my Mini's Toslink output to either of my iFi Audio Sdif Purifiers connected to my SMSL M200 dac solely via Coaxial the pop/crack sound is completely eliminated with no audible deterioration in sound quality. This configuration solves the problem.

However if I connect the Toslink ouput from either of my iFi Sdif Purifiers solely to the Toslink input of my SMSL dac the pop/crack is not eliminated. It stays exactly the same. This configuration does not solve the problem.

The iFi Spdif Purifiers have a Toslink and a Coaxial output. They both operate at the same time.

Please note that if I connect both outputs to my SMSL dac at the same time and select solely the Coaxial input on the dac (i.e. Toslink input turned off) the pop/crack sound is not eliminated. This configuration does not solve the problem. That may sound implausible but that's exactly what happens.

For the sake of confirmation I have repeated the above configurations a number of times, always with the same result.

When I substitute my SMSL dac for my iFi xDSD dac connected via Toslink to an iFi Spdif Purifier connected to the WIIM Mini via Toslink the pop/crack is completely eliminated. This configuration solves the problem. The iFi xDSD does not have a coaxial input.

I am not an audio/electronics engineer so I am unable to offer any explanation.

What about iFi xDSD connected directly to Mini?

 

[AdieH]

When using the WIIM Android app or TIDAL Connect Android app or Audirvana Studio (Mac) my WIIM Mini transmits a loud pop/crack sound to my SMSL M200 dac when changing tracks manually. It also happens when I change from e.g. TIDAL to a radio station. My experience is pretty much the same as previous contributors to this thread.

So I tried connecting my WIIM Mini to an iFi Audio Spdif Purifier #2 via Spdif and plugged the Spdif Purifier #2 into my SMSL M200 dac via Coaxial. This set up has completely eliminated the loud pop/crack sound. Please note that the iFi Audio Spdif Purifier #2 is also a Spdif/Coaxial converter.

I have no idea whether other manufacturers' Spdif/Coaxial converters will produce the same positive result.

I have tried both the original version of iFi Audio's Spdif Purifier and the more recent #2 version. I was using them in other systems. They are both equally effective to completely eliminate the WIIM Mini's pop/crack sound with no appreciable loss of audio quality, at least as far as I can hear.

So if you have a spare Spfif/Coaxial converter why not try it and see if it works?

Thanks for this! Good to know there's a solution.

My only comment is that I feel I shouldn't need to buy another piece of hardware to fix the problem (this is not directed at you, but is a general comment).

 

[Cincyret]

What a great product & Support! The last firmware/app update fixed my crackling problen...crackling when connected to TV optical output.
I listened to 3 hrs on my Sony...No Crackling! Thank-you WiiM team!
Heres my setup:
Inputs: Ethernet & TV (optical)
Output: ONLY 1! - Coax to DAC (actualy I have a coax splitter to 2 DACs)
Sources: Qobuz Hi-res, and TV optical audio.
Everything works - Hi-res & TV - Speakers & Headphones
Minimal cabling - Ethernet, Toslink, Coax - one of each
This was just what I wanted & it's all working!
Thanks again!

 

[GMcC]

What about iFi xDSD connected directly to Mini?

If my iFi xDSD is connected directly to my WIIM Mini there are no pops or cracks i.e. exactly the same positive result as when I connect the WIIM Mini to the xDSD via the iFi Spdif Purifier. Both configurations completely solve the problem. This also applies when using TIDAL Connect and/or the WIIM app (Android). I can switch from track to track, playlist to artist radio to radio station to Bluetooth etc all without any extraneous pops or cracks.

Unlike my SMSL M200 dac the iFi xDSD is powered from its own internal battery. The M200 is powered from its own power brick attached to the mains supply. I have no idea whether other battery powered dacs are also immune to the pops and cracks generated by the WIIM Mini. It may be worth investigating?

 

[GMcC]

Thanks for this! Good to know there's a solution.

My only comment is that I feel I shouldn't need to buy another piece of hardware to fix the problem (this is not directed at you, but is a general comment).

I completely agree with you. Do all WIIM Mini's have this defect? Or only a faulty batch? In either case it is incumbent on WIIM to sort it out and not leave it to the purchaser to resolve at his own expense.

 

[onlyoneme]

If my iFi xDSD is connected directly to my WIIM Mini there are no pops or cracks i.e. exactly the same positive result as when I connect the WIIM Mini to the xDSD via the iFi Spdif Purifier. Both configurations completely solve the problem. This also applies when using TIDAL Connect and/or the WIIM app (Android). I can switch from track to track, playlist to artist radio to radio station to Bluetooth etc all without any extraneous pops or cracks.

Unlike my SMSL M200 dac the iFi xDSD is powered from its own internal battery. The M200 is powered from its own power brick attached to the mains supply. I have no idea whether other battery powered dacs are also immune to the pops and cracks generated by the WIIM Mini. It may be worth investigating?

It shouldn't matter because you use an optical connection between your devices.

I think that there are different situations here when popping appears, and different reasons. I consider spdif relocking as the main one because WiiM tends to force switching off/on its optical output on any manual track switching. Spotify Connect is not affected so I suggest to test the behavior here. If no popping with Spotify it could suggest that the main reason is mentioned spdif relock.
It depends on the audio chain if DAC relock is audible or not. Any device connected in the middle like iFi Purifier or spdif switch can change the observed behavior especially if it keeps its digital output always on regardless of the device connected to the input.

 

[Klipscher]

It shouldn't matter because you use an optical connection between your devices.

I think that there are different situations here when popping appears, and different reasons. I consider spdif relocking as the main one because WiiM tends to force switching off/on its optical output on any manual track switching. Spotify Connect is not affected so I suggest to test the behavior here. If no popping with Spotify it could suggest that the main reason is mentioned spdif relock.
It depends on the audio chain if DAC relock is audible or not. Any device connected in the middle like iFi Purifier or spdif switch can change the observed behavior especially if it keeps its digital output always on regardless of the device connected to the input.

I think you’re right, in my case it’s spdif relocking since only happens when the bitrate changes. I looked into the iFi Spdif Purifier but not worth the price imho. Going try some other wallwarts thou to see if that might help.

 

[Smartplug]

I think you’re right, in my case it’s spdif relocking since only happens when the bitrate changes. I looked into the iFi Spdif Purifier but not worth the price imho. Going try some other wallwarts thou to see if that might help.

Hello my friend klipscher, those ifi purifier are expensive nearing the cost of the pro. In my case I haven’t experience clicking/pop on smsl do 200, hopefully you will find solutions that won’t cost that much.

 

[AdieH]

UPDATE: This issue is now resolved for people who have a Denafrips Ares II with the 12th Anniversary Firmware update. Thanks to Klipscher for the heads up! It was just made available recently. It fixes the clicking and popping when switching between tracks using an optical connection.

However, I have now have a DAC that sounds completely different. Better in some areas: more detail, more resolving, great sound stage, thumpier bass. But the downsides: sharp, bright, glassy and fatiguing on my ears. The trade mark "warmth" of this DAC that I loved is now all gone. I'm going to give it a few more days, but am considering rolling back the firmware.

Thanks all for your help and discussion on this thread!

ADVICE: If you have a different DAC, seek out whether they have a firmware update.

 

[onlyoneme]

UPDATE: This issue is now resolved for people who have a Denafrips Ares II with the 12th Anniversary Firmware update. Thanks to Klipscher for the heads up! It was just made available recently. It fixes the clicking and popping when switching between tracks using an optical connection.

However, I have now have a DAC that sounds completely different. Better in some areas: more detail, more resolving, great sound stage, thumpier bass. But the downsides: sharp, bright, glassy and fatiguing on my ears. The trade mark "warmth" of this DAC that I loved is now all gone. I'm going to give it a few more days, but am considering rolling back the firmware.

Thanks all for your help and discussion on this thread!

ADVICE: If you have a different DAC, seek out whether they have a firmware update.

Do you use the same digital filter on the Ares II?

 

[AdieH]

Do you use the same digital filter on the Ares II?

I’ve tried both filters, and NOS/OS, and these don’t really make much of a difference.

 

[oddyo]

I moved recently and at the same time I sold my Benchmark dac/pre and bought a new dac and seperate preamp. I have the clicking sound between evey track now. I am using the stock optical cable from my wiim mini to my dac and playing Amazon HD exclusively. I never had this problem before my move and dac change. Does anyone have any advice to solve this? Should I just buy a Wiim Pro or another streamer? Thanks!

 

[Mr Ee]

I hear Benchmark do a nice dac/preamp that doesn't exhibit this behaviour

I assume you're considering a pro as you could try coax instead of optical.
If I was getting a click between tracks at all I'd try it out for you.
Send me your dac and preamp and I'll give it a whirl...

 

[oddyo]

I hear Benchmark do a nice dac/preamp that doesn't exhibit this behaviour

I assume you're considering a pro as you could try coax instead of optical.
If I was getting a click between tracks at all I'd try it out for you.
Send me your dac and preamp and I'll give it a whirl...

I was thinking of getting another streamer that connects via ethernet as opposed to wifi...

 

[Mr Ee]

Interesting that you're thinking wifi vs ethernet rather than optical vs coax.
Not saying it's wrong, or shouldn't be considered, just interesting!

 

[Mistabowjangles]

Hi Ryan - I think this is probably rights. I've been doing some research around this issue and this makes a lot of sense.

I'm wondering if I would have the same issue with Coax, but I don't have a coax source to test it with.

In any event, I'm going to contact Denafrips and see what they say.

with toslink/ spdif connected from wiim to theta pro progeny dac on booting wiim, the dac reports a cycle of 3 locks and unlocks and settles on unlock. a lock performs once an active connection is made from source (ie phone) and play commences and plays very well and stable until; the input source changes a new app is chosen a new album or song is selected and curiously the volume is set to zero at which point the wiim spdif output goes low and the device unlocks generating a huge and unbearable amount of white noise for 1-2secs. seems to me like any. or digital / cd tranaport the wiim needs under an circumstance to output all the time the settings set in the app. in my case 44.1/16bit i need to know if this is hardware failure or firmware, and potentially fixable. if not i need to know asap as will need to go back to amazon. thanks

Hi Ryan - I think this is probably rights. I've been doing some research around this issue and this makes a lot of sense.

I'm wondering if I would have the same issue with Coax, but I don't have a coax source to test it with.

In any event, I'm going to contact Denafrips and see what they say.

i've a theta pro progeny dac and on top of hearing the odd pop am also experiencing huge white noice on each unlock and lock

summary:

with toslink/ spdif connected from wiim to theta pro progeny dac on booting wiim, the dac reports a cycle of 3 locks and unlocks and settles on unlock.

a lock performs once an active connection is made from source (ie phone) and play commences and plays very well and stable until;

the input source changes
a new app is chosen
a new album or song is selected
and curiously the volume is set to zero

at which point the wiim spdif output goes low and the device unlocks generating a huge and unbearable amount of white noise for 1-2secs. l

seems to me like any. or digital / cd tranaport the wiim needs under any circumstance to output all the time the settings set in the app. in my case 44.1/16bit

i need to know if this is hardware failure or firmware, and potentially fixable. if not i need to know asap as will need to go back to amazon!!

 

[onlyoneme]

Thank you and will follow up with our eng. team on this topic and report back whenever there's an update.

And nothing seems to have happened...