Ongoing Beta Beta Test: Precision Room Correction with FDW (Frequency-Dependent Windowing)

WiiM Team

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Hi WiiM Community,

We’re excited to introduce Precision Room Correction with Frequency-Dependent Windowing (FDW) — a powerful enhancement to our Room Correction feature. FDW focuses on capturing direct sound while minimizing the impact of room reflections, resulting in more accurate measurements and a more natural, balanced sound.

To enable this feature, go to Room Correction settings. Refer to the screen below for guidance:

1742810673939.png

Happy testing!
WiiM Team
 
please max gain in postif and neg differency for calculation and finish beta for mmm ;-)
 
Yes. Boosting a trough more than 3 dB has never sounded good to me. Pulling down a 10 dB peak can on the other hand save the day.
 
Hi WiiM Community,

We’re excited to introduce Precision Room Correction with Frequency-Dependent Windowing (FDW) — a powerful enhancement to our Room Correction feature. FDW focuses on capturing direct sound while minimizing the impact of room reflections, resulting in more accurate measurements and a more natural, balanced sound.

To enable this feature, go to Room Correction settings. Refer to the screen below for guidance:

View attachment 18876

Happy testing!
WiiM Team
Hi @WiiM Team ,

Does this feature affect mainly high frequency measurements?

Does it mean that the difference between the actual sound heard and the sound picked up by the microphone is reduced?
 
Yes. Boosting a trough more than 3 dB has never sounded good to me. Pulling down a 10 dB peak can on the other hand save the day.
and it is important that this is considered at the time of calculation... (as well as not the temptation to accumulate points to increase the corrections and exceed the fixed gain limit)
 
Does it affect the way how the sound is captured or the way how the captured sound is analyzed? I think that the latter by fine tuning the length of time windows.
 
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Hi WiiM Community,

We’re excited to introduce Precision Room Correction with Frequency-Dependent Windowing (FDW) — a powerful enhancement to our Room Correction feature. FDW focuses on capturing direct sound while minimizing the impact of room reflections, resulting in more accurate measurements and a more natural, balanced sound.

To enable this feature, go to Room Correction settings. Refer to the screen below for guidance:

View attachment 18876

Happy testing!
WiiM Team
to technical explain " for every body"...?
(the use of the powerful rew is very educational on these points)
;-)
 
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Does it affect the way how the sound is captured or the way how the captured sound is analyzed? I think that the latter by fine tuning the length of time windows.
adapting the chirp to the desired windows calculation of correction is generally the first point to integrate in basic ;-)
 
Could this be similar to VAR smoothing in REW?
It is conceptually different to variable smoothing, but it is a procedure that indeed results in a kind of 'variable' smoothing of frequency response.

FDW (frequency-dependent windowing) is a time-domain gating methodology designed to match the length of a specific number of sound cycles at a specific frequency. This means that the time-domain window length decreases as frequency goes up.

FDW is supported in REW as well - you can read about it here.

The intention of FDW is that the time-window at low frequencies will remain long enough to include room resonances, but at high frequencies it will be short enough to completely filter out the effects of reflections, and thereby capture only the loudspeaker direct sound.
Theoretically this captures the loudspeaker+room combined response at low frequencies, but only the loudspeaker direct response at high frequencies - which in principle corresponds well to the way humans perceive sound in rooms so is theorized to provide better-sounding room correction results.

However, IME how well this works in practice depends on the details of FDW configuration - which should be tuned for the specific room, MLP location and loudspeaker placement. I personally find that in most cases correction based on simple MMM with standard variable smoothing in REW works just as well (or better), and is significantly simpler.
 
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It is conceptually different to variable smoothing, but it is a procedure that indeed results in a kind of 'variable' smoothing of frequency response.

FDW (frequency-dependent windowing) is a time-domain gating methodology designed to match the length of a specific number of sound cycles at a specific frequency. This means that the time-domain window length decreases as frequency goes up.

FDW is supported in REW as well - you can read about it here.

The intention of FDW is that the time-window at low frequencies will remain long enough to include room resonances, but at high frequencies it will be short enough to completely filter out the effects of reflections, and thereby capture only the loudspeaker direct sound.
Theoretically this captures the loudspeaker+room combined response at low frequencies, but only the loudspeaker direct response at high frequencies - which in principle corresponds well to the way humans perceive sound in rooms so is theorized to provide better-sounding room correction results.

However, IME how well this works in practice depends on the details of FDW configuration - which should be tuned for the specific room, MLP location and loudspeaker placement. I personally find that in most cases correction based on simple MMM with standard variable smoothing in REW works just as well (or better), and is significantly simpler.
ending up on the mmm, and optimizing the +/- gains are pretty basically the priorities I think..(smoothing is already available, even if the very classic "variable" is missing)

(but if I have a little practice , materiels, in acoustic measurements..it is not in room correction, or just on, I recognize it well... ;-)
I'm afraid it should be avoided if you have good acoustics...or bad acoustics ;-) )
 
It is conceptually different to variable smoothing, but it is a procedure that indeed results in a kind of 'variable' smoothing of frequency response.

FDW (frequency-dependent windowing) is a time-domain gating methodology designed to match the length of a specific number of sound cycles at a specific frequency. This means that the time-domain window length decreases as frequency goes up.

FDW is supported in REW as well - you can read about it here.

The intention of FDW is that the time-window at low frequencies will remain long enough to include room resonances, but at high frequencies it will be short enough to completely filter out the effects of reflections, and thereby capture only the loudspeaker direct sound.
Theoretically this captures the loudspeaker+room combined response at low frequencies, but only the loudspeaker direct response at high frequencies - which in principle corresponds well to the way humans perceive sound in rooms so is theorized to provide better-sounding room correction results.

However, IME how well this works in practice depends on the details of FDW configuration - which should be tuned for the specific room, MLP location and loudspeaker placement. I personally find that in most cases correction based on simple MMM with standard variable smoothing in REW works just as well (or better), and is significantly simpler.
ending up on the mmm, and optimizing the +/- gains are pretty basically the priorities I think..(smoothing is already available, even if the very classic "variable" is missing)

(but if I have a little practice in acoustic measurements..it is not in room correction, or just on, I recognize it well... ;-)
I'm afraid rc should be avoided if you have good acoustics...or bad acoustics, (or use only for <80-100hz );-)
)
 
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It is conceptually different to variable smoothing, but it is a procedure that indeed results in a kind of 'variable' smoothing of frequency response.

FDW (frequency-dependent windowing) is a time-domain gating methodology designed to match the length of a specific number of sound cycles at a specific frequency. This means that the time-domain window length decreases as frequency goes up.

FDW is supported in REW as well - you can read about it here.

The intention of FDW is that the time-window at low frequencies will remain long enough to include room resonances, but at high frequencies it will be short enough to completely filter out the effects of reflections, and thereby capture only the loudspeaker direct sound.
Theoretically this captures the loudspeaker+room combined response at low frequencies, but only the loudspeaker direct response at high frequencies - which in principle corresponds well to the way humans perceive sound in rooms so is theorized to provide better-sounding room correction results.

However, IME how well this works in practice depends on the details of FDW configuration - which should be tuned for the specific room, MLP location and loudspeaker placement. I personally find that in most cases correction based on simple MMM with standard variable smoothing in REW works just as well (or better), and is significantly simpler.
I had a look at impulse response and FDW in REW and couldn't make head nor tail of it. How do you use FDW in REW?
 
First impressions of the precision room correction is that it definitely sounds very different to standard room correction. I used independent channel with subwoofer and there is mainly less bass. The evaluation response also showed a massive 30dB dip around 4kHz.
Looking forward to hearing other opinions.
 
First impressions of the precision room correction is that it definitely sounds very different to standard room correction. I used independent channel with subwoofer and there is mainly less bass. The evaluation response also showed a massive 30dB dip around 4kHz.
Looking forward to hearing other opinions.
Good to hear. When I get a chance I will do critical listening and see if John Lennon sound different from what I used of hear. You said sound different is it sounds for the better or vice versa?
 
Good to hear. When I get a chance I will do critical listening and see if John Lennon sound different from what I used of hear. You said sound different is it sounds for the better or vice versa?
I will need to listen more at a time when I can play louder but it might sound better 🤷‍♂️
 
I will need to listen more at a time when I can play louder but it might sound better 🤷‍♂️
Initial listening sounds balanced and greater clarity at the expense smaller soundstage. Having it off, it had diffused sound field less focus. With that said, if soundstage matters more you will have it off. If clarity what matters more you will want it on.
 
First impressions of the precision room correction is that it definitely sounds very different to standard room correction. I used independent channel with subwoofer and there is mainly less bass. The evaluation response also showed a massive 30dB dip around 4kHz.
Looking forward to hearing other opinions.
I got exactly the same. Huge dip that is not present in the main analysis and eq but present in final evaluation
 
I had a look at impulse response and FDW in REW and couldn't make head nor tail of it. How do you use FDW in REW?
Perhaps first it would be good to take one step back and explain impulse response windowing in general.

May I suggest reading this short miniDSP article on the subject? It illustrates very nicely how gating of the in-room measured impulse response filters-out reflections and thereby only the loudspeaker direct sound remains.
On the same topic I suggest to also have a look at this amazing post by napilopez over at ASR. I very much recommend reading it as well.

The (very) short and dirty explanation is that the direct sound takes the fastest path to the microphone (i.e. straight line) so comes earlier than any reflections (which all take indirect paths since they need to bounce off something).
We then cut-off (i.e. "window") the measured impulse response at the point just before the reflection reaches the microphone, thereby filtering out all of the reflections.

When this technique is used to measure loudspeakers it is often called "quasi-anechoic" method, and it can be used to create loudspeaker measurements that are comparable to those from anechoic chambers and Klippel NFS, perfectly matching them above about 1kHz (though some resolution is lost below 1kHz due to gating).

FDW (frequency-dependent windowing) is following the same concept of windowing the impulse response to filter-out the reflected sound, but it does this with different window lengths at different frequencies - specifically by decreasing window length as frequency increases. This means that the reflected sound is kept in the response at low frequencies, but is progressively filtered out as frequency increases.

Let's now look at the example from REW help:
If the width is in cycles a 15 cycle window (for example) would have a width of 150 ms at 100 Hz (15 times 10 ms), 15 ms at 1 kHz (15 times 1 ms) and 1.5 ms at 10 kHz (15 times 0.1 ms).
Note that a 100Hz tone has a cycle length of 10ms (1/100 s), and a 10kHz tone has a cycle length of 0.1ms (1/10000 s) - so if we set FDW window length instead to 5 cycles we'd get:
10Hz -> 5 x 100ms = 500ms
20Hz -> 5 x 50ms = 250ms
50Hz -> 5 x 20ms = 100ms
100Hz -> 5 x 10ms = 50ms
200Hz -> 5 x 5ms = 25ms
500Hz -> 5 x 2ms = 10ms
1kHz -> 5 x 1ms = 5ms
2kHz -> 5 x 0,5ms = 2,5ms
5kHz -> 5 x 0,2ms = 1ms
Etc...

If we now assume a trivial example where both a loudspeaker and a microphone are both 1m above the floor, but 2,5m apart we can calculate that the floor reflection will arrive to the microphone ~2ms after the direct sound. This means that our 5-cycle FDW should filter out the effect of this floor reflection completely above ~2,5kHz, but it will keep the floor reflection effects in the response below 2,5kHz.

Hopefully this also illustrates the issue with FDW - not all rooms will have the same layout, and not everyone will position their loudspeakers the same - so the FDW cycle setting cannot be universal for every room/layout/placement.

Also, since we have multiple reflective surfaces around the loudspeaker and the listening position (MLP), with their different path lengths, the various reflections will come with different delays after the direct sound to the MLP - this means that a specific FDW cycle setting will not be equally effective at removing all of these reflections at specific frequency ranges.

To sum up - IMHO FDW is an interesting concept to experiment with, but I've personally always found it less effective and more complicated than simply using MMM with variable smoothing in REW to correct resonances below the room transition frequency (usually below 400Hz).
Corrections above the room transition frequency are not "room correction" anymore, it becomes "loudspeaker correction" instead - and this better done based on anechoic measurements rather than FDW.
Note that a lot of EQ presets for various loudspeaker models based on anechoic measurements can be found on spinorama.org.
 
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