WiiM Ultra Firmware v5.2.630635 Update - Sep 27, 2024

[Dennis from Venice]

I just submitted a feedback as my trigger is still not working after this update (although it initially worked after the update - the next day it didn't). I also have an issue with my Mac APP......the device input and output choices are not correct. My IOS devices have all available but the Mac version is missing quite a few. For instance, instance "ethernet" is missing from Input, and "headphone" is missing from output.

In addition, the screen turning off was instead always on after the update even thought the settings had it to turn off in standby. Now, I get the clock in standby.

Seems something fishy is going on in standby when the unit times out.

 

[slartibartfast]

Haha, that’s why I don’t like to be beta tester because if new features comes out you will be left behind. Do you still want to be beta tester? If not, you can opt it out where the update location.

I have asked WiiM if it's worth me staying on the beta since it doesn't currently work with the subwoofer. Let's see what they say. I wonder how many are using the beta.

 

[harkpabst]

I rarely use my ears to calibrate anything because they're poor measurement instruments (ears generally not just mine).

I generally agree (I'm not inclined with the golden ear group in this or any other forum). Making a relative judgement like "which is louder" for a pure sine wave should be doable by ear, though.

It still shouldn't be greyed out though

I could easily confirm (by ear ) that the high pass filter still works, even if the slider is greyed out. Setting the crossover frequency to 250 Hz makes it a piece of cake.

I also start to see the reasoning behind the greyed out slider. The whole idea behind SBM is not to let the sub play as high as it can (although someone might think so). The idea is to let the subwoofer's built-in low pass match the WiiM's high pass for the mains. So the process (leaving out level and delay adjustments) would be like:

1. Select your desired high pass frequency in the WiiM Home App.
2. Enable Subwoofer Bypass mode.
3. Adjust the subwoofer's upper frequency knob until you get a good match.

In this scenario it actually makes sense to protect you from unintentionally changing the high pass crossover frequency, once your setup is complete.

If you want to try out a different setting, disable SBM, select a different high pass filter crossover frequency and enable SBM again. This will almost for sure require you to change your sub's settings.

At a second thought I feel like WiiM once again turned out smarter than me.

 

[slartibartfast]

I generally agree (I'm not inclined with the golden ear group in this or any other forum). Making a relative judgement like "which is louder" for a pure sine wave should be doable by ear, though.


I could easily confirm (by ear ) that the high pass filter still works, even if the slider is greyed out. Setting the crossover frequency to 250 Hz makes it a piece of cake.

I also start to see the reasoning behind the greyed out slider. The whole idea behind SBM is not to let the sub play as high as it can (although someone might think so). The idea is to let the subwoofer's built-in low pass match the WiiM's high pass for the mains. So the process (leaving out level and delay adjustments) would be like:

1. Select your desired high pass frequency in the WiiM Home App.
2. Enable Subwoofer Bypass mode.
3. Adjust the subwoofer's upper frequency knob until you get a good match.

In this scenario it actually makes sense to protect you from unintentionally changing the high pass crossover frequency, once your setup is complete.

Hmm, I think you are giving them too much credit. You might be protected from unintentionally changing the high pass filter but you can still switch both toggle switches "unintentionally"

 

[harkpabst]

Hmm, I think you are giving them too much credit. You might be protected from unintentionally changing the high pass filter but you can still switch both toggle switches "unintentionally"

True.

But at least that greyed out slider may give you a reminder that you are in SBM without scrolling to the bottom of the page.

 

[slartibartfast]

True.

But at least that greyed out slider may give you a reminder that you are in SBM without scrolling to the bottom of the page.

Once you enter Subwoofer Bypass Mode you also need to worry about the phase control on the Subwoofer as well as the delay control in the app

 

[Wiimer]

1. Select your desired high pass frequency in the WiiM Home App.
2. Enable Subwoofer Bypass mode.
3. Adjust the subwoofer's upper frequency knob until you get a good match.

In this scenario it actually makes sense to protect you from unintentionally changing the high pass crossover frequency, once your setup is complete.

If you want to try out a different setting, disable SBM, select a different high pass filter crossover frequency and enable SBM again. This will almost for sure require you to change your sub's settings.

That is, in essence, what I meant to say. (Yes, I just lied.)

Nevertheless, thank you for using "SBM".

 

[Smartplug]

I’m not sure what’s the idea when sub bypass is enabled the crossover become unadjustable and greyed out. Did someone ask wiim about this?

 

[Wiimer]

I’m not sure what’s the idea when sub bypass is enabled the crossover become unadjustable and greyed out. Did someone ask wiim about this?

With any luck, @RyanWithWiim will ask the team.

 

[andyp]

Changing source is the only thing thats still horrible. I only use wifi and optical and switching takes forever with the remote. I doesnt respond, or it jumps two sources at once. Please make it possible to config a number on the remote to a source.

 

[Smartplug]

With any luck, @RyanWithWiim will ask the team.

He’s hardly being here.

 

[sNc]

Changing source is the only thing thats still horrible. I only use wifi and optical and switching takes forever with the remote. I doesnt respond, or it jumps two sources at once. Please make it possible to config a number on the remote to a source.

I already asked about this. It should work in a way that you freerly change it and the effect starts after 3 seconds from your last click on pilot

 

[harkpabst]

Once you enter Subwoofer Bypass Mode you also need to worry about the phase control on the Subwoofer as well as the delay control in the app

Think about it, phase control on the sub and delay settings in the WiiM Home App matter just as much with SBM enabled as with SBM disabled. SBM just affects the frequency limit, nothing else.

The only thing to worry about could be if a sub using DSP filtering (and thus introducing an additional delay) might bypass all DSP processing in LFE mode or not. If so, then switching from LFE mode to the subwoofer's own low pass filter could require additional delay for the mains.

Nevertheless, thank you for using "SBM".

That's simply what it's called, isn't it? I'm sure your term will be found on Wikipedia shortly.

 

[slartibartfast]

Think about it, phase control on the sub and delay settings in the WiiM Home App matter just as much with SBM enabled as with SBM disabled. SBM just affects the frequency limit, nothing else.

The only thing to worry about could be if a sub using DSP filtering (and thus introducing an additional delay) might bypass all DSP processing in LFE mode or not. If so, then switching from LFE mode to the subwoofer's own low pass filter could require additional delay for the mains.


That's simply what it's called, isn't it? I'm sure your term will be found on Wikipedia shortly.

I think when using LFE mode with the filter disabled the phase control on the sub doesn't do anything. It only has an effect near the crossover frequency when the crossover is set on the sub. It surprised me when I first noticed it but changing the phase on the sub had no effect at all when the crossover was set in the WiiM app. Only the delay setting in the app had an effect.

 

[harkpabst]

I think when using LFE mode with the filter disabled the phase control on the sub doesn't do anything. It only has an effect near the crossover frequency when the crossover is set on the sub. It surprised me when I first noticed it but changing the phase on the sub had no effect at all when the crossover was set in the WiiM app. Only the delay setting in the app had an effect.

That'd make little sense, but might solely depend on the subwoofer in use. It's not the low pass filter that makes phase adjustment necessary.

 

[Smartplug]

Since the implementation of sbm it made my sub produce tight solid bass. Prior to the toggle, it was sound loose and no matter what adjustments I can’t get it to sound tight and solid. Now, my next favorite update which I hope will get release soon the auto timing for rc.

 

[slartibartfast]

That'd make little sense, but might solely depend on the subwoofer in use. It's not the low pass filter that makes phase adjustment necessary.

Aren't you changing the phase of the signal at the crossover frequency? I admit I don't really know but the phase control only has an effect around the crossover frequency. Probably

 

[harkpabst]

Aren't you changing the phase of the signal at the crossover frequency? I admit I don't really know but the phase control only has an effect around the crossover frequency. Probably

Yes, the phase changes along with the attenuation. But this change in phase doesn't need to be fixed. . The matching high pass filter for the mains also exhibits an amount of phase change at the crossover frequency and low pass and high pass sum up nicely.

What needs to be fixed is any difference in running time between the two signals. It can be caused by different distances to the listener or different processing times in the sub and the amp/pre-processor.

It is still true indeed that the biggest impact shows up around the crossover frequency. It's that range where summation is happening. One octave above or below there would still be a timing difference between sub and mains but given that the sub only reproduces bass this isn't really relevant.

If you stick with setting the delay (either direction) in the WiiM Home App and don't touch the phase knob (or switch) on the sub at all, you never have to worry about how these controls work on the sub.

 

[sNc]

I compared 80 hz crossover in the app with 80 hz crossover on my REL HT1205 Mk2 when using SBM, and they are not close. With cross set in the Wiim app, the 80 hz band is much less audible. It means that the slope must be much different between these two

I thought with the drop comes only after the set frequency, and that 80 hz will be heard very similarly between the two

 

[harkpabst]

I thought with the drop comes only after the set frequency, and that 80 hz will be heard very similarly between the two

The WiiM Ultra implements a clean and precise 4th order Linkwitz-Riley filter. That means that the level right at the crossover frequency is down by 6 dB compared to the pass band. If the low pass filter would drop just after the crossover frequency and the matching high pass filter would drop just before the crossover frequency you would end up with a massive peak at that frequency.

It means that the slope must be much different between these two

It's even more complicated than that. While the WiiM Ultra's crossover works the same, precisely and exact no matter if you select 30 Hz or 250 Hz, this cannot be said of must subwoofer's filters (unless they use digital filters). Unfortunately there seem to be no measurements of the HT/1205 MKII, but a Finish magazine made some measurements on its predecessor, the HT/1205.

Look at how the frequency response changes when setting the "crossover" knob to minimum (red), 12 o'clock (green) and maximum (black) position:

It's a mess. You might think you are manipulating the crossover frequency, but you actually change the frequency, the filter slope and the level in the pass band! There's nothing wrong with trying things out. Just be aware that there might be more variables than originally expected.

So, if a system sounds better with SBM enabled and the subwoofer's low pass filter engaged, it could be simply because of a different resulting level. I would have hoped for extended subwoofer management settings in the form of independent crossover frequencies and possibly filter slopes for high pass and low pass, instead.